Modern drivetrain

Larry Davick

Larry Davick

Well-known member
May 9, 2007
3,778
23
48
Fremont, Ca.
I clearly need to get busy and stop thinking of nonsense. All the discussions I've seen about Diesel engines, vortec, etc also bemoan the lack of a modern transmission. It seems to me that part of the problem is that we keep thinking of the drivetrain mounted conventionally and not transversely. I suspect a transverse setup would eliminate the oil pan issues and open the door for a larger selection of power plants and transmissions.

Are there any front drive power trains that might work from a minivan or ??

As I said I've got to get to work.
--
Larry Davick
A Mystery Machine
1976(ish) Palm Beach
Fremont, Ca
 
if i remember, the Impala SS of about 10 years ago had a transverse LS motor that was limited to 300 HP. I don't know what the torque was. Maybe that would work?
--
Todd

New owner of a 1976 Eleganza II 26?
other toys:
94 Vette
84 Goldwing
72 CB750 Chopper
96 Caprice Classic
and gone but not forgotten 34 Ford roadster
 
  Monte Carlo  5.3 L 320 hp. My nephew has I believe an 06. It was the last year GM built this set-up. Same motor as in the p/u's It also cut back to 4 cyl & got 30 mpg on the highway.
 Norm


>
>
>if i remember, the Impala SS of about 10 years ago had a transverse LS motor that was limited to 300 HP.  I don't know what the torque was.  Maybe that would work?
>--
>Todd
>
>New owner of a 1976 Eleganza II 26’
>other toys:
>94 Vette
>84 Goldwing
>72 CB750 Chopper
>96 Caprice Classic
>and gone but not forgotten 34 Ford roadster
>_______________________________________________
>GMCnet mailing list
>Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>
>
>
 
With the GMC, I'd imagine you need torque, not hp to move a coach. Torque
is the stuff bigger engines are made of. A SBC or LS Chevy may have hp, but
the constant pounding of moving a GMC I'd imagine would wear it (engine and
FWD transaxle) out a lot sooner.

I'd propose changing the floor in the GMC a bit, then modify the frame for
a duramax diesel and the transfer case/trans combo. Use the front of the
transfer case to drive the front wheels.

Torque, 1 ton internals, diesel power and parts meant for heavy duty usage.
It will move a GMC easily and do so for a LONG time.

Sammy Williams

>
>
> >monte carlo
>
> Norm, this may be a decent prospect. This gm forum thread is worth a read
> regarding performance issues and fwd transmissions (an earlier Grand Prix
> was also mentioned)
>
> http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/f69/monte-carlo-ss-5-3l-question-47718/
> --
> 77 Royale Coachmen Side Dry Bath
> 76 Birchaven Coachmen Side Wet Bath
> http://www.gmcmotorhomesforsale.com/
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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>
 
Of course if I really could do it, (would be recreating the floo ans the
drive liner) I'd move the engine bay to under the full size bed, where a
small detroit diesel and drivetrain could sit and drive the GMC from the
back. The engine would sit between the generator and LPG areas, then a
small drive axle (driveshaft) would drive the back tires.using a small
gearbox to keep the floor low in that area. the floor in front could then
be made fully flat if desired, including the drive area since there is no
more intrusion from the engine

But as they say, I am no engineer. lol :)

> With the GMC, I'd imagine you need torque, not hp to move a coach. Torque
> is the stuff bigger engines are made of. A SBC or LS Chevy may have hp, but
> the constant pounding of moving a GMC I'd imagine would wear it (engine and
> FWD transaxle) out a lot sooner.
>
> I'd propose changing the floor in the GMC a bit, then modify the frame for
> a duramax diesel and the transfer case/trans combo. Use the front of the
> transfer case to drive the front wheels.
>
> Torque, 1 ton internals, diesel power and parts meant for heavy duty
> usage. It will move a GMC easily and do so for a LONG time.
>
> Sammy Williams
>
>

>
>>
>>
>> >monte carlo
>>
>> Norm, this may be a decent prospect. This gm forum thread is worth a
>> read regarding performance issues and fwd transmissions (an earlier Grand
>> Prix was also mentioned)
>>
>> http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/f69/monte-carlo-ss-5-3l-question-47718/
>> --
>> 77 Royale Coachmen Side Dry Bath
>> 76 Birchaven Coachmen Side Wet Bath
>> http://www.gmcmotorhomesforsale.com/
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
>
>
 
Greetings:

Since we are all having ?fun? with this?. A while back I pencil whipped some thoughts up going the diesel-electric route!

I also used Sammy?s thought of a small diesel electric in the back powering either wheel motors on each swing arm:

http://www.proteanelectric.com/

Or same thought, diesel electric in back, and just getting rid of everything in the front clip and using a motor like this to power front wheels:

http://hpevs.com/catalog-ac-75-27.26.htm

Ah?. So many ideas?.. So little money :d

Carl P.
76 Birchaven
South of Fremont
 
Hard to believe given my personality type, but usually, I stick to the practical rather than the dreaming side of GMC engines. But, building on Sammy's idea of the rear motor under the bed, I wonder if a V-drive system out of an inboard boat hooked to the end of a traditional rwd trans facing backwards might work for that. I'm not all that familiar with them, you might end up with more speeds in reverse than you could use, and only one in forward, depending . . .
--
Craig Lechowicz
'77 Kingsley, Waterford, MI
 
That's the way the V8 UltraVans are set up. how many speeds in which
direction depends on which way the motor faces, and how the differential
is installed.

RonC

On Sun, 28 Apr 2013 16:16:13 -0500 Craig Lechowicz

>
>
> Hard to believe given my personality type, but usually, I stick to
> the practical rather than the dreaming side of GMC engines. But,
> building on Sammy's idea of the rear motor under the bed, I wonder
> if a V-drive system out of an inboard boat hooked to the end of a
> traditional rwd trans facing backwards might work for that. I'm not
> all that familiar with them, you might end up with more speeds in
> reverse than you could use, and only one in forward, depending . .
> .
> --
> Craig Lechowicz
> '77 Kingsley, Waterford, MI
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>

Ron & Linda Clark
1978 Eleganza II
North Plains, ORYGUN
 
you guys check back
when you have something installed and 200,000 miles on it
:>)
gene

> That's the way the V8 UltraVans are set up. how many speeds in which
> direction depends on which way the motor faces, and how the differential
> is installed.
>
> RonC
>
> On Sun, 28 Apr 2013 16:16:13 -0500 Craig Lechowicz

> >
> >
> > Hard to believe given my personality type, but usually, I stick to
> > the practical rather than the dreaming side of GMC engines. But,
> > building on Sammy's idea of the rear motor under the bed, I wonder
> > if a V-drive system out of an inboard boat hooked to the end of a
> > traditional rwd trans facing backwards might work for that. I'm not
> > all that familiar with them, you might end up with more speeds in
> > reverse than you could use, and only one in forward, depending . .
> > .
> > --
> > Craig Lechowicz
> > '77 Kingsley, Waterford, MI
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >
>
>
> Ron & Linda Clark
> 1978 Eleganza II
> North Plains, ORYGUN
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>

--
Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
-------
http://bdub.net/gmcmotorhome.info/
Alternator Protection Cable
http://bdub.net/gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
 
Well, the RTS coaches GM made in the late 70s and early 80s used a
v-drive setup, as i recall. Of course, the DD engine they had, and the
allison transmission had an overall height from the pavement of
somewhere around five feet....

> you guys check back
> when you have something installed and 200,000 miles on it
> :>)
> gene
>
>
>

>
>> That's the way the V8 UltraVans are set up. how many speeds in which
>> direction depends on which way the motor faces, and how the differential
>> is installed.
>>
>> RonC
>>
>> On Sun, 28 Apr 2013 16:16:13 -0500 Craig Lechowicz

>> >
>> >
>> > Hard to believe given my personality type, but usually, I stick to
>> > the practical rather than the dreaming side of GMC engines. But,
>> > building on Sammy's idea of the rear motor under the bed, I wonder
>> > if a V-drive system out of an inboard boat hooked to the end of a
>> > traditional rwd trans facing backwards might work for that. I'm not
>> > all that familiar with them, you might end up with more speeds in
>> > reverse than you could use, and only one in forward, depending . .
>> > .
>> > --
>> > Craig Lechowicz
>> > '77 Kingsley, Waterford, MI
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > GMCnet mailing list
>> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>> >
>>
>>
>> Ron & Linda Clark
>> 1978 Eleganza II
>> North Plains, ORYGUN
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
> “Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
> -------
> http://bdub.net/gmcmotorhome.info/
> Alternator Protection Cable
> http://bdub.net/gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
 
I'm with you Gene. I find nothing wrong with the flat tappet 455 that is in ANNIE. Had it for 9 years and use Mobil-1 15W50.
So far no problems w/ the engine (but I may have just used up my luck with that statement). Will be leaving for Bean Station on Wed morning with about 12 hours on the road. JimB and I have been talking about a tear down in the next yr or two to see how she is holding up. ....but I would rather just drive her.

jwid

jim galbavy
'73 x-CL ANNIE
Lake Mary, Fl
 
Have my 350 Olds motor warmed up every day and I'm starting in on the interior now.  Don't have miles on it yet but it sure runs good.  If you want a rear engine GMC, come up with the seed money & we have an idea.  Still in the "napkin" stage, from here the cubic dollar theory would take over, heck while we're at it how bout a 4 wheel drive, twin engine monster!  Lets really jump out there!  I can dream big...
 
Jim Bounds
-----------------


________________________________
From: gene Fisher
To: gmclist
Sent: Monday, April 29, 2013 11:41 AM
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Modern drivetrain


you guys check back
when you have something installed and 200,000 miles on it
:>)
gene

> That's the way the V8 UltraVans are set up.  how many speeds in which
> direction depends on which way the motor faces, and how the differential
> is installed.
>
> RonC
>
> On Sun, 28 Apr 2013 16:16:13 -0500 Craig Lechowicz

> >
> >
> > Hard to believe given my personality type, but usually, I stick to
> > the practical rather than the dreaming side of GMC engines.  But,
> > building on Sammy's idea of the rear motor under the bed, I wonder
> > if a V-drive system out of an inboard boat hooked to the end of a
> > traditional rwd trans facing backwards might work for that.  I'm not
> > all that familiar with them, you might end up with more speeds in
> > reverse than you could use, and only one in forward, depending . .
> > .
> > --
> > Craig Lechowicz
> > '77 Kingsley, Waterford, MI
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >
>
>
> Ron & Linda Clark
> 1978 Eleganza II
> North Plains, ORYGUN
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>

--
Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
“Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
-------
http://bdub.net/gmcmotorhome.info/
Alternator Protection Cable
http://bdub.net/gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
 
And, of course, you are using the same standard to judge the OEM power
plant Gene?
Steve F

> you guys check back
> when you have something installed and 200,000 miles on it
> :>)
> gene
>
>
>

>
> > That's the way the V8 UltraVans are set up. how many speeds in which
> > direction depends on which way the motor faces, and how the differential
> > is installed.
> >
> > RonC
> >
> > On Sun, 28 Apr 2013 16:16:13 -0500 Craig Lechowicz

> > >
> > >
> > > Hard to believe given my personality type, but usually, I stick to
> > > the practical rather than the dreaming side of GMC engines. But,
> > > building on Sammy's idea of the rear motor under the bed, I wonder
> > > if a V-drive system out of an inboard boat hooked to the end of a
> > > traditional rwd trans facing backwards might work for that. I'm not
> > > all that familiar with them, you might end up with more speeds in
> > > reverse than you could use, and only one in forward, depending . .
> > > .
> > > --
> > > Craig Lechowicz
> > > '77 Kingsley, Waterford, MI
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > GMCnet mailing list
> > > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> > > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> > >
> >
> >
> > Ron & Linda Clark
> > 1978 Eleganza II
> > North Plains, ORYGUN
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
> “Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
> -------
> http://bdub.net/gmcmotorhome.info/
> Alternator Protection Cable
> http://bdub.net/gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>

--
Take care,
Steve
 
Don't care
Just don't break
FREE WIFI @ Mickey D



> And, of course, you are using the same standard to judge the OEM power
> plant Gene?
> Steve F
>
>

>
>> you guys check back
>> when you have something installed and 200,000 miles on it
>> :>)
>> gene
>>
>>
>>

>>
>>> That's the way the V8 UltraVans are set up. how many speeds in which
>>> direction depends on which way the motor faces, and how the differential
>>> is installed.
>>>
>>> RonC
>>>
>>> On Sun, 28 Apr 2013 16:16:13 -0500 Craig Lechowicz

>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hard to believe given my personality type, but usually, I stick to
>>>> the practical rather than the dreaming side of GMC engines. But,
>>>> building on Sammy's idea of the rear motor under the bed, I wonder
>>>> if a V-drive system out of an inboard boat hooked to the end of a
>>>> traditional rwd trans facing backwards might work for that. I'm not
>>>> all that familiar with them, you might end up with more speeds in
>>>> reverse than you could use, and only one in forward, depending . .
>>>> .
>>>> --
>>>> Craig Lechowicz
>>>> '77 Kingsley, Waterford, MI
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>>>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Ron & Linda Clark
>>> 1978 Eleganza II
>>> North Plains, ORYGUN
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> GMCnet mailing list
>>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Gene Fisher -- 74-23,77PB/ore/ca
>> “Give a man a fish; you have fed him for today --- give him a URL and
>> -------
>> http://bdub.net/gmcmotorhome.info/
>> Alternator Protection Cable
>> http://bdub.net/gmcmotorhome.info/APC.html
>> _______________________________________________
>> GMCnet mailing list
>> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
>> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Take care,
> Steve
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
 
I don't know. Short of a total computer controlled engine and tranny I'm not sure there is enough of a ROI. The 455/403/Caddy engines are just rock solid pushrod engines.

Yeah, the new stuff has all sorts of fancy controls (that I can't work on or even understand)but guess what? 12500 lbs with the frontal area we have at 60mph ain't ever going to go into 'supercruise overdrive' even if we had a tranny that had it. A nice Allison tranny and new turbo diesel could be good but face it, you're talking cubic dollars.

If you don't want a real GMCHM, you could just buy an SOB pusher and put a GMC body on it... 8o . Might be cheaper in the long run that trying to engineer and fabricate a complete new powertrain. I've got a friend with a 40' Holiday Rambler Cat Diesel pusher that gets about 20.... It's a pre-slideout generation and they are cheap used...under 50.

Sure you could do some stuff with a new engine, make a new chain drive, adapt to a new tranny and rear end but you're going to spend a year and $$$$ doing it. I've got the equipment and skills to do it but not really the years left. Plus it would get into your living space....and never have a positive ROI.

How many miles do you have to drive at 12-14 mpg (I'd be surprised if you could get much more) to justify spending even 10K as opposed to 8-10mpg with the stock setup??? I'm too tired to do the math but it's certainly more than I'll live long enough to drive.

I think I'm with Gene on this one.
--
Kerry Pinkerton

North Alabama, near Huntsville,

77 Eleganza II, "The Lady", 403CI, also a 76 Eleganza being re-bodied as an Art Deco car hauler
 
If you don't want a real GMCHM, you could just buy an SOB pusher and put a GMC body on it.../quote]

I couldn't find the picture(s), but I remember seeing someone who had done just that and it was at a rally that I also can't remember :( - The pictures caption(s) implied it took more parts than just one GMC to convert it - The conversion was also WAY taller - I always wondered who it belonged to and how much it cost to do - Maybe this will trigger someone's memory!

Carl P.
76 Birchaven
South of Fremont
 
That was at the first GMCMI Amana, UA convention in 2007. I'll have to search my files to come up with the owners name. It was for sale.

Emery Stora

>
>

> If you don't want a real GMCHM, you could just buy an SOB pusher and put a GMC body on it.../quote]
>
> I couldn't find the picture(s), but I remember seeing someone who had done just that and it was at a rally that I also can't remember :( - The pictures caption(s) implied it took more parts than just one GMC to convert it - The conversion was also WAY taller - I always wondered who it belonged to and how much it cost to do - Maybe this will trigger someone's memory!
>
> Carl P.
> 76 Birchaven
> South of Fremont
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
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Link to photo by DanG

http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/gmcmi-2007-fall-convention-amana-colonies/p22597-hpim3207-medium-1.html

GMC on steroids...

Dennis

Emery Stora

>
>

> > If you don't want a real GMCHM, you could just buy an SOB pusher and put a GMC body on it.../quote]
> >
> > I couldn't find the picture(s), but I remember seeing someone who had done just that and it was at a rally that I also can't remember :( - The pictures caption(s) implied it took more parts than just one GMC to convert it - The conversion was also WAY taller - I always wondered who it belonged to and how much it cost to do - Maybe this will trigger someone's memory!
> >
> > Carl P.
> > 76 Birchaven
> > South of Fremont
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> > http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://temp.gmcnet.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/gmclist


--
Dennis S
73 Painted Desert 230
Germantown, TN
 
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