The Ferrigno Family's 1976 Palm Beach

[tmsnyder]

Factory tolerance is too loose. The races pound out the knuckle and that is why they fail early.

I thought I saw a drawing once upon a time and remember the clearance being fairly tight, like 0.0005" or so. I don't remember it being a large clearance, like more than 0.002" But it was definitely a clearance fit. The maintenance manual states "The outer race of the bearing is a snug fit into the knuckle. Light tapping on the hubs outer surface (not the disc) will aid assembly"

I just can't see how such a tight tolerance could be pounded out over time, maybe if they spun a bearing though.

I wonder if a product like Loctite Bearing Retainer would be helpful here in supporting the bearing more evenly between the outer race and the knuckle. And extend its lifetime even further.

While I think of it, when you go to reassemble, ......IIRC it's handy to cut slots into the retainer bolt heads so you can use a screwdriver for most of the installation and future disassembly.

 

[pvfjr]

While I think of it, when you go to reassemble, ......IIRC it's handy to cut slots into the retainer bolt heads so you can use a screwdriver for most of the installation and future disassembly.

Yep, I'll be doing that for sure. I can only imagine how awkward it would be otherwise. I've considered some Loctite as well, but I'll have to think about how I'd convince the grease and the Loctite to each stay where they belong during assembly.

I did some measuring last night, best I could do with some calipers. I need to borrow some micrometers. I did use telescoping bore gauges, so that helped. On the new Timken bearing, I got a 2.000" ID. The old bearing was 1.995". The hub shank was 2.005". It seems they wore each other down evenly. The hub surface is a little rough too.

DJ is within driving distance, and I noticed his website offers a hub/knuckle service just like Dave Lenzi, but he talks about building up the surfaces with a chrome bath instead of the spray welding. I may give him a call and see what thicknesses he can do. Looks like I'd need 25 ten-thousandths, plus whatever needed to come off to clean it up first in preparation.

 

[tmsnyder]

I'm just thinking of the knuckle / outer race fit. Loctite 638 can fill up to 0.010 inch.

Yep, I'll be doing that for sure. I can only imagine how awkward it would be otherwise. I've considered some Loctite as well, but I'll have to think about how I'd convince the grease and the Loctite to each stay where they belong during assembly.

 

[Matt Colie]

Todd,
What you seem to have missed (and this would be easy for someone that does not have the correct background) is that the bore of the OE knuckles was done with a single point tool (not a reamer level surface) so they were virtually threaded. The crown of this thread will easily be pounded down to make enough of a loose fit so the outer races can turn and wear.
Yes, one or more of the Loctite things could fix this, at least in the short term. A problem might develop as those things do not have a real good fatigue life.
Matt

 

[pvfjr]

Well the good news is, my carrier bearing puller works on wheel hubs. I would've preferred a hydraulic solution, but it's done.


There's a definite step on the hub where is transitions from the outer and inner bearing areas.

 

[pvfjr]

Well I got the passenger side torn down. Same problem with the hub wear. Same finger-tight axle nut. I'm convinced someone serviced these bearings and didn't know what they were doing.

On another bad note, Amazon's supplier sent the wrong water pump. Ugh. The invoice and box were correct, but the bagged part inside was wrong. It's a pretty wacky looking water pump.

 

[pvfjr]

I stripped down the noisiest of the rear bearings tonight. Funny, the outer bearing looked fine but the race was pitted. Conversely, the inner bearing was thrashed, but the race was fine. Go figure.



It was apparent the bearing was recently serviced. The grease looked practically new. The seal was worn however, and the seal surface on the spindle was a little pitted. There are no appropriately sized Speedi Sleeves to be had, so I'll be polishing this up.

 

[pvfjr]

I decided to check the condition of the hubs on the parts coach. It was tough getting things apart. Ground was annoyingly soft. Axle nut was stupidity stuck, been sitting motionless for 30 years. I thought I was going to explode my socket. Took a lot of bouncing on a six foot cheater pipe. I'm not sure why I didn't use my torque multiplier; that was dumb.

Anyway, the bearings seem to be in good shape somehow! No indication that the hubs will be bad. I'll get this driver's side stripped down and put the micrometer on it.

 

[Mike_H]

If you strike out on the parts coach...I have what I presume to be a good set of knuckles and hubs sitting around in a crate, left over from my one ton swap. PM Me if you're interested.

 

[pvfjr]

Weather has been quite poor, and family obligations have been high, but I've done a little work on the rear. I got the worst spindle polished up, and found I'll need to do a bit of polishing on the one in front of it too. But, at least for the "worst" corner, the driver's rear, things are actually going back together. I've got some riveted Wagner pads going in. I had thought I had wheel seals, but I guess I was wrong. I'll be looking for some SKF 21771 later today.

 

[kbeefy]

Well the good news is, my carrier bearing puller works on wheel hubs. I would've preferred a hydraulic solution, but it's done.
View attachment 8071 View attachment 8072

I have the Yukon gear version of that puller, I was wondering if it would work for those.

 

[pvfjr]

I have the Yukon gear version of that puller, I was wondering if it would work for those.

I'll soon find out if I can do a double. So far it's only pulled the outer bearing, as my inners just fell off. But with the 'good' hub from the parts coach, the full set of bearings are still stuck on the hub, as they should be. I might have to try to get a bearing separator between the two bearings, perhaps where the spacer sits, so I can get them apart. We'll see; hopefully tomorrow.

 

[pvfjr]

Another night, another spindle to polish.


There sure wasn't much left of that shoe! Parking brake cables were all seized up, not to mention the pathetic excuse for an equalizer. I don't imagine it helped things wear evenly. I'll be figuring something else out with readily available parts.


It feels good to actually be putting something together for once. I'll be taking the drums to a local shop to have them checked out and potentially cleaned up a bit.

 

[pvfjr]

More news...


I've got extra energy tonight. I decided to strip down the donor hub. It looks great! I pressed the inner and outer bearings off one at a time so I could feel how tight they were. They were a very nice, press fit. Once again, a seal surface needed some cleaning up.


I'm getting real good at making messes around here. The carrier bearing puller is still pulling its weight around here.

 

[kbeefy]

Did you need that bearing knife or did the pinion bearing puller do it all? It looks pretty clean.

 

[pvfjr]

Did you need that bearing knife or did the pinion bearing puller do it all? It looks pretty clean.

Good question. I ended up not using it. The only way to get a bite with it would have been to attack the space where the spacer is. Pushing the spacer to one side, I could get a purchase under the inner bearing with one half, but the other half would have to grab the spacer where it sticks out. Then I'd either have to pull on it in a crooked orientation, or shim it with something on the half that grabs the bearing. I opted to try something else.

What ended up working well was using a larger size of clamshell on the carrier bearing puller. I found one of the yellow cut-outs that would grab the outer race of the outer bearing, but leave the bearing itself behind. This way I was able to pull both races, spacer, and inner bearing in one shot. That just left the outer bearing behind, which I knew I could deal with since that's what I started with.

I may do a video when I get to the other side. Hopefully the 2nd side will include less floundering and provide a better example.

 

[pvfjr]

I started getting ready to replace the CV boots. I left the long shaft in place on the passenger side, and just pulled the joint by releasing the snap ring. I cleaned everything up from the outside as well as I could, but was concerned about any possible contamination on the inside. So I was compelled to completely strip it down, and am glad I did. This joint that had no apparent slop was poised to become much, much worse in the near future. It looks like I'll be going back to the parts coach again.

 

[pvfjr]

I've also now discovered the worst rear bearing and worst brake shoe that the coach had to offer. The matching shoe had a good bit of friction material still left. I believe this bonded shoe delaminated. There were lots of chunks floating around inside.


The auto-adjuster's return spring was also dislodged, and part of the adjuster setup fell out on the ground when I pulled the drum. Yikes.


Back on the topic of front bearings, I pulled the other hub from the parts coach. Bearings were tight and well greased again, with no sign of water intrusion. This makes me happy, of course, but I'm a bit perplexed by another discovery. The bearing/seal retainer was installed with a shim. I've not seen this before. I'm wondering if it was a replacement retainer, and had different measurements that were compensated for. I hope there isn't a dimensional difference with the knuckles or the hubs, since my intent is to mix and match. I have some measuring to do.

 

[kbeefy]

View attachment 8247

Sweet Molten Lava! That sucker got hot!

 

[pvfjr]

Sweet Molten Lava! That sucker got hot!

I bet it did. I could hear that one singing on the 10 mile drive home from the towing yard. I knew if I could hear a rear wheel bearing, it was going to be a bad one.