What are the generator and LP gas compartment doors made of?

RJW

Well-known member
Dec 23, 2005
1,631
108
63
SE Michigan
palmbeachgmc.com
During routine (dumping my holding tank via macerator) motorhome service, the rear hinge of my generator access door broke away from the door itself.
When it broke away, it came close to breaking the door in half. :(

I need to repair it before I can go on any more trips.

Is the door fiberglass or SMC (sheet molded compound)?

Any ideas of what to use to repair it other than epoxy?

It's a good thing it didn't happen at a dump station. Not as bad as having the problem occur at home.
--
Richard
76 Palm Beach
SE Michigan
www.PalmBeachGMC.com


Coop Roller Cam 455, Howell TBI + EBL, 3.42 FD, Quadra Bag, Macerator, Lenzi stuff, Manny Tranny etc.
 
You may be able to fix it with something like Plexus Adhesive?
--
Rich Mondor,

Brockville, ON

77 Hughes 2600
 
Hey Richard. The doors are the same as the rest of the body panels - SMC. I've used 3M 8115 two part epoxy cartridges and I've used a couple
different flavors of epoxies with fiberglass mesh. West System G/Flex is a personal favorite. I'm not sure that I'd have confidence in a repair
using something other than epoxy. Why are you looking for an alternative?

Richard
--
'77 Birchaven TZE...777;
'76 Palm Beach with 18,477 verified miles;
‘76 Edgemonte
 
What Richard said.
When the wheel took out the bottom corner of the front fender I saved the pieces from the scene, cleaned them and the area up, and stuck the puzzle
back together with cyanoacrylate (superglue). Then I was able to rough the shiny outside parts and close off the gaps and a hole from the inside with
duct tape(don't leave home without a roll of the good stuff but I used the cheap variety on this because I wanted easy removal later). Next a layer of
fiberglass mat, cut fibers(very short) to fill the hole and gaps, and some marine epoxy leftover from boat modifications. Wax paper over the outside
gives a smooth finish and kept the epoxy in place on the vertical surface until it cured.

A later repair elsewhere has demonstrated that the variety of epoxy available at the auto parts store also bonds well to the SMC as long as it is
prepped correctly.
--
Terry Kelpien

ASE Master Technician

73 Glacier 260

Smithfield, Va.
 
The auto parts store variety being the type sold with the fiberglass repair kit.
--
Terry Kelpien

ASE Master Technician

73 Glacier 260

Smithfield, Va.
 
> Hey Richard. The doors are the same as the rest of the body panels - SMC. I've used 3M 8115 two part epoxy cartridges and I've used a couple
> different flavors of epoxies with fiberglass mesh. West System G/Flex is a personal favorite. I'm not sure that I'd have confidence in a repair
> using something other than epoxy. Why are you looking for an alternative?
>
> Richard

I have had bad results with epoxy repairs to plastic parts in my GMC. A hood access panel (5 years ago) repair and an attempted repair to the cockpit
headliner (20 years ago) all failed. Maybe my preparation was the problem. Perhaps West System epoxy would work better.

I have another trip planned in a few weeks and a broken generator access door would keep me from the trip.
--
Richard
76 Palm Beach
SE Michigan
www.PalmBeachGMC.com


Coop Roller Cam 455, Howell TBI + EBL, 3.42 FD, Quadra Bag, Macerator, Lenzi stuff, Manny Tranny etc.
 
I use a plastic supplier that has a number of stores for the chassis boards
for my wireless air systems. They have all manner and types of plastics.
Some are joined by solvents that partially dissolve the material, and
release those solvents to cure or bond. Others, like SMC have release
agents throughout the material, and if you disturb the surfaces, will
release those agents and destroy the bond strength of polyester resins used
in many body repair products. They look like all is well, but over time,
lose their bond with the SMC. Ihave the best results using 2 part epoxy
resins formulated for use on SMC. Body shops often use very specific
products made just for use on SMC. Todd Sullivan can steer you right on the
correct products to use.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Oregon

On Wed, Sep 2, 2020, 9:08 PM RJW via Gmclist
wrote:

> > Hey Richard. The doors are the same as the rest of the body panels -
> SMC. I've used 3M 8115 two part epoxy cartridges and I've used a couple
> > different flavors of epoxies with fiberglass mesh. West System G/Flex
> is a personal favorite. I'm not sure that I'd have confidence in a repair
> > using something other than epoxy. Why are you looking for an
> alternative?
> >
> > Richard
>
> I have had bad results with epoxy repairs to plastic parts in my GMC. A
> hood access panel (5 years ago) repair and an attempted repair to the
> cockpit
> headliner (20 years ago) all failed. Maybe my preparation was the
> problem. Perhaps West System epoxy would work better.
>
> I have another trip planned in a few weeks and a broken generator access
> door would keep me from the trip.
> --
> Richard
> 76 Palm Beach
> SE Michigan
> www.PalmBeachGMC.com
>
>
> Coop Roller Cam 455, Howell TBI + EBL, 3.42 FD, Quadra Bag, Macerator,
> Lenzi stuff, Manny Tranny etc.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
 
Richard,
Prep and product are everything in epoxy repairs. Clean and degrease the surfaces, scuff sand, then wipe down with acetone within a few minutes of
applying the epoxy.

Evercoat SMC Fiberglass Resin is a polyester resin that I've used, generally though I prefer epoxies. You really can't go wrong with West System
products. You can go wrong by buying them at West Marine - high prices!

The two part epoxy cartridges require a specialized caulking gun. I mentioned the 3M 8115 and there's also SEM 39747. Get extra dispensing tips if
you buy the cartridge as you won't use very much at any one time. I've never used J-B Weld MarineWeld but it specifically says it works with SMC.

You can use any fiberglass cloth or even 2" fiberglass drywall joint mesh tape.

Richard
--
'77 Birchaven TZE...777;
'76 Palm Beach with 18,477 verified miles;
‘76 Edgemonte
 
> I use a plastic supplier that has a number of stores for the chassis boards
> for my wireless air systems. They have all manner and types of plastics.
> Some are joined by solvents that partially dissolve the material, and
> release those solvents to cure or bond. Others, like SMC have release
> agents throughout the material, and if you disturb the surfaces, will
> release those agents and destroy the bond strength of polyester resins used
> in many body repair products. They look like all is well, but over time,
> lose their bond with the SMC. Ihave the best results using 2 part epoxy
> resins formulated for use on SMC. Body shops often use very specific
> products made just for use on SMC. Todd Sullivan can steer you right on the
> correct products to use.
> Jim Hupy
> Salem, Oregon

One product I know now to avoid is "FiberFix" which the package says "Now you can fix anything". I used their 5"x5" patch kit to repair a broken
GMC's "Door Assembly - Engine Access". I call that the hood door. Previously, it flew up when I was driving (I had neglected to lock the "latch
assembly") which caused the "engine access strut" to break away from the hood door leaving a gaping hole. It seemed to work great at the time.

Anyway, the repair worked for a few years until it just fell apart. So I need to fix that as well.

--
Richard
76 Palm Beach
SE Michigan
www.PalmBeachGMC.com


Coop Roller Cam 455, Howell TBI + EBL, 3.42 FD, Quadra Bag, Macerator, Lenzi stuff, Manny Tranny etc.
 
Richard,

I am not trying to brag, but I bet that I have done more repair to the SMC than most owners. But, if you also recall, I have done a great deal of
boat work.

The SMC used in our coaches repairs very well with West Epoxy. Not the G-flex,but the standard 105/205 family. Get the small cans with the pumps.
The pumps are essential as they will prevent a mix failure. For a repair like you want to do, you will also want some basic cloth (6 or 9 oz)(Not mat
- never mat with epoxy) and a maybe few balsa blocks. You will also need a small amount of acetone to preclean before applying epoxy. As mentioned,
this is an essential.

I suspect from what you are saying that you broke out the top flange of the door. This is how I would do the repair. There is not room there to put
in a balsa block, but twelve ounces of glass will be stronger than the OE.

To do this, clean (file/sand) the broken edges so the part will go back where it belongs. Hold it there with masking tape. Have ready (Gloves of
course) a small block covered with some PE so it will break away when done. A soaker board - any sacrificial piece that is not absorbent to use to
saturate the glass fabric (a plastic covered piece of plywood is good). And, a clamp of some kind to hold the block in place while curing. I have
two scissors in my kit. One is the dry and clean set. the other I call the wet shears that are very handy to trim threads and edges of the glass
fabric during the layup process. This pair has to be easily cleaned or disposable.

Cut the glass fabric so you have enough for the full height of the flange and about half again more to go to the door panel. Clean the area with
acetone, twice. Do a mix. Read the instructions, there is some slake time required. First, soak the glass fabric until it is clear, then wet the
surface it is going to. Put the saturated fabric where it goes and work in flat. If you go for a second layer, work that down now and clamp the
block in there and leave it alone.

There is some epoxy left in the mixing bowl. Leave that close to the work and it will tell you when the cure has started.

If you are doing this with the door dismounted, put a layer of polyethylene under it. Epoxy may well run out though the joint and glue it to whatever
is below.

Cheap vinegar is real good for cleaning up the uncured resin.

If you need, you have my phone number.

Matt
--
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
 
My father and uncle started a corvette restoration business in the late
70s. The company is still in business some 40+ years later, and I tend to
lean on him for my fiberglass repair advice. I'm sure those who spend their
lives servicing boats are even more knowledgeable. Anyways...

A highway cone was sucked into my lane when the semi ahead of me smacked it
with its rear axles. I ALMOST missed it, but the good ol awning frame took
the impact. It tore out 2 of the 3 screws in the base. We used medical
grade epoxy on the repair. The old timers said that theyve found it much
stronger than automotive epoxies, and less apt to temperature expansion.
Anyways, the Corvette shop uses it over automotive epoxies for any repair
that is visible to the eye. They said that you can always tell where epoxy
was used in fiberglass repair when the sun heats up the panel. The medical
grade stuff hides better.

Who knows if its true or not. Just what i was told by my dad =)

On Thu, Sep 3, 2020 at 11:46 AM Matt Colie via Gmclist <

> Richard,
>
> I am not trying to brag, but I bet that I have done more repair to the SMC
> than most owners. But, if you also recall, I have done a great deal of
> boat work.
>
> The SMC used in our coaches repairs very well with West Epoxy. Not the
> G-flex,but the standard 105/205 family. Get the small cans with the pumps.
> The pumps are essential as they will prevent a mix failure. For a repair
> like you want to do, you will also want some basic cloth (6 or 9 oz)(Not mat
> - never mat with epoxy) and a maybe few balsa blocks. You will also need
> a small amount of acetone to preclean before applying epoxy. As mentioned,
> this is an essential.
>
> I suspect from what you are saying that you broke out the top flange of
> the door. This is how I would do the repair. There is not room there to
> put
> in a balsa block, but twelve ounces of glass will be stronger than the OE.
>
> To do this, clean (file/sand) the broken edges so the part will go back
> where it belongs. Hold it there with masking tape. Have ready (Gloves of
> course) a small block covered with some PE so it will break away when
> done. A soaker board - any sacrificial piece that is not absorbent to use
> to
> saturate the glass fabric (a plastic covered piece of plywood is good).
> And, a clamp of some kind to hold the block in place while curing. I have
> two scissors in my kit. One is the dry and clean set. the other I call
> the wet shears that are very handy to trim threads and edges of the glass
> fabric during the layup process. This pair has to be easily cleaned or
> disposable.
>
> Cut the glass fabric so you have enough for the full height of the flange
> and about half again more to go to the door panel. Clean the area with
> acetone, twice. Do a mix. Read the instructions, there is some slake
> time required. First, soak the glass fabric until it is clear, then wet the
> surface it is going to. Put the saturated fabric where it goes and work
> in flat. If you go for a second layer, work that down now and clamp the
> block in there and leave it alone.
>
> There is some epoxy left in the mixing bowl. Leave that close to the work
> and it will tell you when the cure has started.
>
> If you are doing this with the door dismounted, put a layer of
> polyethylene under it. Epoxy may well run out though the joint and glue it
> to whatever
> is below.
>
> Cheap vinegar is real good for cleaning up the uncured resin.
>
> If you need, you have my phone number.
>
> Matt
> --
> Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL,
> GMCES
> Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum
> Brakes with Applied Control Arms
> SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
 
> Richard,
>
> I am not trying to brag, but I bet that I have done more repair to the SMC than most owners. But, if you also recall, I have done a great deal of
> boat work.
>
> The SMC used in our coaches repairs very well with West Epoxy. Not the G-flex,but the standard 105/205 family. Get the small cans with the
> pumps. The pumps are essential as they will prevent a mix failure. For a repair like you want to do, you will also want some basic cloth (6 or 9
> oz)(Not mat - never mat with epoxy) and a maybe few balsa blocks. You will also need a small amount of acetone to preclean before applying epoxy.
> As mentioned, this is an essential.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
>
> Matt

Lots of good information here and what was sent to me privately. Who knew that there was more to repairing things than Bondo?

I called up West System tech support and actually got through to someone who was familiar with GMC motorhomes and SMC. He suggested that I use West
System 650 G/Flex and fiberglass cloth. So Matt, why do you prefer standard 105/205 family to G/Flex?

By the way, great detailed instructions.

--
Richard
76 Palm Beach
SE Michigan
www.PalmBeachGMC.com


Coop Roller Cam 455, Howell TBI + EBL, 3.42 FD, Quadra Bag, Macerator, Lenzi stuff, Manny Tranny etc.
 
> Lots of good information here and what was sent to me privately. Who knew that there was more to repairing things than Bondo?
>
> I called up West System tech support and actually got through to someone who was familiar with GMC motorhomes and SMC. He suggested that I use
> West System 650 G/Flex and fiberglass cloth. So Matt, why do you prefer standard 105/205 family to G/Flex?
>
> By the way, great detailed instructions.

Richard,

Polyester body fillers are real not very good for much.

The tech people the Gougeon tech people are real good. That being what they said, I would have to seriously consider it. The reason I suggested what
I did was this is materials that I have been using for over thirty years. They sure could have come up with something better. I do not know if they
have pump dispensers for the 650 G/flex. That is why I gravitate to the 105/205. In the years I have used it, I have never had a mix failure. The
claim (as I recall) of the 650s was the flexibility when cured. That us not something you should need.

I just reread you original posting. You say you broke the door in half? That makes this a bigger job, but did you see how I put the left front
corner of our coach back together after the bumper crashed into it. It still needs some appearance work, but it is together.

We are a fair distance apart, but if you have reservations, you could bring the door down here and we can do the fix. The only reason I suggest here
is that I have all my stuff here. I am short on vinegar at the moment, but I have lot of the other things. Or, you can send me pictures and and we
can talk about it.

It is the LP door? I can lend you a spare off Frank's parts coach.

Matt
--
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit
 
> > Lots of good information here and what was sent to me privately. Who knew that there was more to repairing things than Bondo?
> >
> > I called up West System tech support and actually got through to someone who was familiar with GMC motorhomes and SMC. He suggested that I
> > use West System 650 G/Flex and fiberglass cloth. So Matt, why do you prefer standard 105/205 family to G/Flex?
> >
> > By the way, great detailed instructions.
>
> Richard,
>
> Polyester body fillers are real not very good for much.
>
> The tech people the Gougeon tech people are real good. That being what they said, I would have to seriously consider it. The reason I suggested
> what I did was this is materials that I have been using for over thirty years. They sure could have come up with something better. I do not know
> if they have pump dispensers for the 650 G/flex. That is why I gravitate to the 105/205. In the years I have used it, I have never had a mix
> failure. The claim (as I recall) of the 650s was the flexibility when cured. That us not something you should need.
>
> I just reread you original posting. You say you broke the door in half? That makes this a bigger job, but did you see how I put the left front
> corner of our coach back together after the bumper crashed into it. It still needs some appearance work, but it is together.
>
> We are a fair distance apart, but if you have reservations, you could bring the door down here and we can do the fix. The only reason I suggest
> here is that I have all my stuff here. I am short on vinegar at the moment, but I have lot of the other things. Or, you can send me pictures and
> and we can talk about it.
>
> It is the LP door? I can lend you a spare off Frank's parts coach.
>
> Matt

Matt,
Thanks for the additional info and offer to help.

The door in question is the generator/house battery compartment.

What happened was the aft hinge failed (detached from the door) at some point during the last few days. We had just returned from a week in the UP
and use that compartment to store and activate our macerator so I am in and out of it often. When I went to open it the other day, the air spring
(there are 2) started to move the aft portion of the door up. The springs are pretty strong. Since the middle hinge was still intact, the panel
started to fold up in the middle at the center hinge. It could have folded in half had I not noticed and held it down. So I am left with a ~5" crack
to the right of the middle hinge and a totally broken hinge attachment point on the panel.

Probably not a big deal to repair if you've done it before, which I have not.
--
Richard
76 Palm Beach
SE Michigan
www.PalmBeachGMC.com


Coop Roller Cam 455, Howell TBI + EBL, 3.42 FD, Quadra Bag, Macerator, Lenzi stuff, Manny Tranny etc.
 
Richard,

One of the POs made the same 'improvement' and added overly strong gas struts to hold the door open. Same results, though mine wasn't as bad as yours
- it just pulled out the hinge. After the repair I went back to something similar to the OEM hold open - a short little bungie cord.

Richard
--
'77 Birchaven TZE...777;
'76 Palm Beach with 18,477 verified miles;
‘76 Edgemonte
 
> Richard,
>
> One of the POs made the same 'improvement' and added overly strong gas struts to hold the door open. Same results, though mine wasn't as bad as
> yours - it just pulled out the hinge. After the repair I went back to something similar to the OEM hold open - a short little bungie cord.
>
> Richard

Those air springs have been on there for over 20 years. I replaced the Bungie (rubber bands) with the hooks on the end when a couple broke and the
hooks were lost. This was one of the first improvements I made after buying the coach in 1998. It was a kit from Golby. I replaced all 4 air
springs (McMaster-Carr) about 10 years ago when one ran out of gas. I have been very happy with the springs.

I don't think the air springs caused the problem. Rather it was a misalignment (IMHO) of the door with the door's frame. It was binding in the
corner near where the aft hinge is located. I noticed that a few years ago, but never did anything about it because I ran out of "GMC Get Around
Round 2 its"
--
Richard
76 Palm Beach
SE Michigan
www.PalmBeachGMC.com


Coop Roller Cam 455, Howell TBI + EBL, 3.42 FD, Quadra Bag, Macerator, Lenzi stuff, Manny Tranny etc.
 
> Matt,
> Thanks for the additional info and offer to help.
>
> The door in question is the generator/house battery compartment.
>
> What happened was the aft hinge failed (detached from the door) at some point during the last few days. We had just returned from a week in the
> UP and use that compartment to store and activate our macerator so I am in and out of it often. When I went to open it the other day, the air
> spring (there are 2) started to move the aft portion of the door up. The springs are pretty strong. Since the middle hinge was still intact, the
> panel started to fold up in the middle at the center hinge. It could have folded in half had I not noticed and held it down. So I am left with a
> ~5" crack to the right of the middle hinge and a totally broken hinge attachment point on the panel.
>
> Probably not a big deal to repair if you've done it before, which I have not.

Richard,

The real and honest answer is that it would not be a big deal for me to do the structural repair. That is because I have more experience than the
average bear. From your description, the door pretty much has to be removed to make a good solid and non-ugly repair. If you might like, and you have
the time to bring it down here, we can do this and you can be the "clean guy". When doing epoxy repairs, it goes real well if you have one guy
playing in the wet epoxy and the other guy staying (more or less) clean and dry. When you see the process, this will make complete sense.

Call me any time if you choose to discuss this in detail. This is the time of year to do this as we don't have to close the shop up and heat it and
we won't be sweating into the mix.

Actually, calling me at your convenience would be a good idea.

Matt
--
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit