Tire Wars

R

ronstyle

New member
Apr 28, 1999
3
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The matter of Michelan tire failures is still a mystery to me. It may well
be tire age and /or overloading. But for me, my experience with the Michelan
XPS Rib E's has been without complaint. The coach I sold recently has
110,000 plus miles and is on it's 4th set of these tires. They have been
running on chromed steel wheels and trued and balanced with each new set.
But it sounds like the Michelans are to be avoided when all the posts are
read and all the rally bull sessions are factored in. I'm glad mine have
been trouble free.

Ron Freeman
x78 Eleganza II
x73 Canyon Lands

By the way I am in the market for an original 77 or 78 Palm Beach. And by
original I mean substantially the same interior and exterior colors as
original.
 
> The matter of Michelan tire failures is still a mystery to me. It may well
> be tire age and /or overloading. But for me, my experience with the
Michelan
> XPS Rib E's has been without complaint.

Thanks for your comments, Ron.

I'm currently contemplating XPS Rib E's for the rear. I've not heard too
much of the Michelin bashing, but have not really been looking for it
either.

Am I making a mistake going to the XPS?
I have to go and buy the tires in the next few days as they are not that
readily available around here and I'd just as soon buy them from a local
dealer for easy of getting them mounted and balanced. Wish I was closer to a
"truer", but they just look at you funny when you mention truing around here
:-)

Thanks in advance for any additional comments folks may have.

Heinz
 
I still think Michelins and Bridgestones are the two best tires, in the E
rated all steel tire, for the GMC motorhome. that is unless you like to
live dangerously and than put whatever you want on.

>The matter of Michelan tire failures is still a mystery to me. It may well
>be tire age and /or overloading. But for me, my experience with the Michelan
>XPS Rib E's has been without complaint. The coach I sold recently has
>110,000 plus miles and is on it's 4th set of these tires. They have been
>running on chromed steel wheels and trued and balanced with each new set.
>But it sounds like the Michelans are to be avoided when all the posts are
>read and all the rally bull sessions are factored in. I'm glad mine have
>been trouble free.
>
>Ron Freeman
>x78 Eleganza II
>x73 Canyon Lands
>
>By the way I am in the market for an original 77 or 78 Palm Beach. And by
>original I mean substantially the same interior and exterior colors as
>original.
>
>
>
>
Tom & Marg Warner
Vernon Center NY
1976 palmbeach
"The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
 
I don't recall any Michelan bashing either. I'm thinking that it'll
probably be my choice when the time comes, also. Aw, there was some
scuttlebutt about em bein a rough ride, but I don't think that'll make that
much difference.

>From what I've seen, they're easier to come up with than the goodyear's,
and a little cheaper.

bdub

>
>> The matter of Michelan tire failures is still a mystery to me. It may well
>> be tire age and /or overloading. But for me, my experience with the
>Michelan
>> XPS Rib E's has been without complaint.
>
>Thanks for your comments, Ron.
>
>I'm currently contemplating XPS Rib E's for the rear. I've not heard too
>much of the Michelin bashing, but have not really been looking for it
>either.
>
>Am I making a mistake going to the XPS?
>I have to go and buy the tires in the next few days as they are not that
>readily available around here and I'd just as soon buy them from a local
>dealer for easy of getting them mounted and balanced. Wish I was closer to a
>"truer", but they just look at you funny when you mention truing around here
>:-)
>
>Thanks in advance for any additional comments folks may have.
>
>Heinz
>
>
 
Heinz I drove my coach with all new Michelin Lt225/75R16 E rated all steel
tires this weekend. When the Michelin tire dealer installed them it took
much longer than they thought it would take. These tires have super strong
sidewalls and were very difficult to put on and seal to the rims. So they
did not have time to balance them. I have to take them back. Drove only
about 20 miles on them or so to the campground where we were having our GMC
Heritage Cruiser rally (23 coaches). They drove smooth as silk and even
without balancing they were much smoother than the old balanced tires. They
did run the tires up on the machine before putting them on the coach and
they were as true as any tire I have ever seen. I would not touch them with
a truing machine.

>
>> The matter of Michelan tire failures is still a mystery to me. It may well
>> be tire age and /or overloading. But for me, my experience with the
>Michelan
>> XPS Rib E's has been without complaint.
>
>Thanks for your comments, Ron.
>
>I'm currently contemplating XPS Rib E's for the rear. I've not heard too
>much of the Michelin bashing, but have not really been looking for it
>either.
>
>Am I making a mistake going to the XPS?
>I have to go and buy the tires in the next few days as they are not that
>readily available around here and I'd just as soon buy them from a local
>dealer for easy of getting them mounted and balanced. Wish I was closer to a
>"truer", but they just look at you funny when you mention truing around here
>:-)
>
>Thanks in advance for any additional comments folks may have.
>
>Heinz
>
>
>
Tom & Marg Warner
Vernon Center NY
1976 palmbeach
"The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
 
> Heinz I drove my coach with all new Michelin Lt225/75R16 E rated all steel
> tires this weekend

Thanks everyone.

Guess I'll plunk my plastic down for the 4 - 215/875R16's and bring the
babies home so that I'll be ready for the new and shiny Alcoas when they get
here. (6 week backlog).

Heinz
 
> Tom said...
> >I drove my coach with all new Michelin Lt225/75R16 E rated all steel...
>
> Is that the same tire as a Lt225/75R16 XPS Rib E?
>
> And Heinz...
> are you running a narrower tread width LT215... higher profile...
> > plunk my plastic down for the 4 - 215/875R16's
>
> assuming you meant 85R16's

Should've been 75R16's

You win the price.... wondered if anyone would catch it (215's, not the typo
:-).

Actually the are 215/75R16's.
Not quite sure how I ended up with 215's but if I recall correctly they were
the closed to match the old with reference to circumference so as to not
affect speedo.
This was pre-net and I was at the mercy of the tire dealer I got the Alcoas
from. In checking with current tire dealer, no real diff other aside from
slightly narrower/taller?

As that's what I have on the front (E's) and that's the size I've been
running for years I don't think I want to mix and match.

....unless someone can make a good case for me doing so :-)

Heinz
 
Tom said...
>I drove my coach with all new Michelin Lt225/75R16 E rated all steel...

Is that the same tire as a Lt225/75R16 XPS Rib E?

And Heinz...
are you running a narrower tread width LT215... higher profile...
> plunk my plastic down for the 4 - 215/875R16's

assuming you meant 85R16's

- --
"I do whatever my Rice Krispies tell me to..." John said, from inside a
1974 Glacier.
 
Heinz you can usually save money by buying the Michelins from one of several
companies that sell tires thru the car magazines. Or if you have a Sams club
they had the LT225/75R16 all steel Michelins for $115/each

>
>> Heinz I drove my coach with all new Michelin Lt225/75R16 E rated all steel
>> tires this weekend
>
>
>Thanks everyone.
>
>Guess I'll plunk my plastic down for the 4 - 215/875R16's and bring the
>babies home so that I'll be ready for the new and shiny Alcoas when they get
>here. (6 week backlog).
>
>Heinz
>
>
>
>
Tom & Marg Warner
Vernon Center NY
1976 palmbeach
"The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
 
yep

>Tom said...
>>I drove my coach with all new Michelin Lt225/75R16 E rated all steel...
>
>Is that the same tire as a Lt225/75R16 XPS Rib E?
>
>And Heinz...
>are you running a narrower tread width LT215... higher profile...
>> plunk my plastic down for the 4 - 215/875R16's
>
>assuming you meant 85R16's
>
>--
>"I do whatever my Rice Krispies tell me to..." John said, from inside a
>1974 Glacier.
>
>
>
Tom & Marg Warner
Vernon Center NY
1976 palmbeach
"The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
 
Back about 1980 I had a full size van with Firestone 721 tires on it. These
tires had a manufacturing defect which caused sidewall separation and one
of them actually blew out on me. As I've read all the posts on tires it
makes me wonder if manufacturing defects had anything to do with the GM
recall. Does anyone else have any recollection along these lines? We have
a lot of anecdotes but from reading them I'm not even sure that the GMC has
a tire failure rate which is statistically different from any other
vehicle. This is difficult stuff to get sound data on. Could it be that the
extra weight and stiffness of the 'E' range tires leads to an increased
incidence of control arm failure ;-)

My coach has been running D range tires for 25 years with no signs of ever
having had a blow out. Nevertheless 'E' range has got to be safer and all
this talk has made me nervous so like several others I'm still trying to
figure out the how and when to switch. (I looked at the 19.5's on a
schoolbus; that's the tire we need. We could jack 'em up like a monster
truck.) Meanwhile there was a thread on alternative 16" steel wheels a few
weeks ago. The thread died with no conclusions. Is there a 16" steel
alternative or are we stuck with only the 16.5's or Alcoa's? Alcoas are
still way down my wish list.

It could be that all this tire controversy is simply due to the way tires
are rated. I would expect any tire to take the side forces generated by an
emergency steering maneuver so the little bit of extra scuffing generated
by the rear bogeys being a hazard doesn't make sense to me. If the tires
are close enough to max loading that the extra scuffing destroys them then
they're way too close to the edge. Most light trucks are only fully loaded
occasionally while in the RV application we're running at max load all the
time. This makes a tire's life on an RV much tougher than if it were on a
typical light truck. This scenario would lead to the apparent derating
needed for for the GMC.

Enjoy

Dick Kennedy
 
Tom,

I didn't mean to say there were increased control arm failures but merely
that there could be. I may have used a poor choice of wording but I was
merely using that as an example of how anecdotes don't amount to sound
engineering and that statement would be just as sound as any other isolated
anecdote is. In that part of the post I wasn't guessing about anything at
all but I do do some speculation further down. I don't disagree with you
it's just that we need a well controlled study to reach valid conclusions
and most of what's been posted here doesn't meet that criteria. I assume
the Cinnabar article is based on a much larger base of experience than any
one person could possibly have so is's much more authoritative.

I don't really think the tires are one of those but I've seen many times in
my career where one 'fix' creates other problems. I've also seen decisions
made that were based on a misinterpretation of the existing data.

Enjoy

Dick

>Dick all you are doing is guessing. Where did you get the idea that there
>have been control arm failures?
>
> why not get the cinnabar July 1999 article on tires for the GMC motorhome
>due out end of June 1999?
>

>>Back about 1980 I had a full size van with Firestone 721 tires on it. These
>>tires had a manufacturing defect which caused sidewall separation and one
>>of them actually blew out on me. As I've read all the posts on tires it
>>makes me wonder if manufacturing defects had anything to do with the GM
>>recall. Does anyone else have any recollection along these lines? We have
>>a lot of anecdotes but from reading them I'm not even sure that the GMC has
>>a tire failure rate which is statistically different from any other
>>vehicle. This is difficult stuff to get sound data on. Could it be that the
>>extra weight and stiffness of the 'E' range tires leads to an increased
>>incidence of control arm failure ;-)
>>
>>My coach has been running D range tires for 25 years with no signs of ever
>>having had a blow out. Nevertheless 'E' range has got to be safer and all
>>this talk has made me nervous so like several others I'm still trying to
>>figure out the how and when to switch. (I looked at the 19.5's on a
>>schoolbus; that's the tire we need. We could jack 'em up like a monster
>>truck.) Meanwhile there was a thread on alternative 16" steel wheels a few
>>weeks ago. The thread died with no conclusions. Is there a 16" steel
>>alternative or are we stuck with only the 16.5's or Alcoa's? Alcoas are
>>still way down my wish list.
>>
>>It could be that all this tire controversy is simply due to the way tires
>>are rated. I would expect any tire to take the side forces generated by an
>>emergency steering maneuver so the little bit of extra scuffing generated
>>by the rear bogeys being a hazard doesn't make sense to me. If the tires
>>are close enough to max loading that the extra scuffing destroys them then
>>they're way too close to the edge. Most light trucks are only fully loaded
>>occasionally while in the RV application we're running at max load all the
>>time. This makes a tire's life on an RV much tougher than if it were on a
>>typical light truck. This scenario would lead to the apparent derating
>>needed for for the GMC.
>>
>>Enjoy
>>
>>Dick Kennedy
>>
>>
>>
>Tom & Marg Warner
>Vernon Center NY
>1976 palmbeach
>"The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
>
>
 
Dick all you are doing is guessing. Where did you get the idea that there
have been control arm failures?

why not get the cinnabar July 1999 article on tires for the GMC motorhome
due out end of June 1999?

>Back about 1980 I had a full size van with Firestone 721 tires on it. These
>tires had a manufacturing defect which caused sidewall separation and one
>of them actually blew out on me. As I've read all the posts on tires it
>makes me wonder if manufacturing defects had anything to do with the GM
>recall. Does anyone else have any recollection along these lines? We have
>a lot of anecdotes but from reading them I'm not even sure that the GMC has
>a tire failure rate which is statistically different from any other
>vehicle. This is difficult stuff to get sound data on. Could it be that the
>extra weight and stiffness of the 'E' range tires leads to an increased
>incidence of control arm failure ;-)
>
>My coach has been running D range tires for 25 years with no signs of ever
>having had a blow out. Nevertheless 'E' range has got to be safer and all
>this talk has made me nervous so like several others I'm still trying to
>figure out the how and when to switch. (I looked at the 19.5's on a
>schoolbus; that's the tire we need. We could jack 'em up like a monster
>truck.) Meanwhile there was a thread on alternative 16" steel wheels a few
>weeks ago. The thread died with no conclusions. Is there a 16" steel
>alternative or are we stuck with only the 16.5's or Alcoa's? Alcoas are
>still way down my wish list.
>
>It could be that all this tire controversy is simply due to the way tires
>are rated. I would expect any tire to take the side forces generated by an
>emergency steering maneuver so the little bit of extra scuffing generated
>by the rear bogeys being a hazard doesn't make sense to me. If the tires
>are close enough to max loading that the extra scuffing destroys them then
>they're way too close to the edge. Most light trucks are only fully loaded
>occasionally while in the RV application we're running at max load all the
>time. This makes a tire's life on an RV much tougher than if it were on a
>typical light truck. This scenario would lead to the apparent derating
>needed for for the GMC.
>
>Enjoy
>
>Dick Kennedy
>
>
>
Tom & Marg Warner
Vernon Center NY
1976 palmbeach
"The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
 
Surprisingly Dick the Cinnabar research was done as a result of the problems
that GM had with the General tires failing, that were originally provided on
the GMC motorhome, and it was done in 1980. Cinnabar did the research for GM
in an effort to show whether there really was a problem with the bias ply
tires (there were), what tire should replace them if indeed the research
showed that there was a problem (there was and Michelins were chosen). I
have copies of the original articles, the test data and the conclusions
drawn by both Cinnabar and GM. that is what I have been basing my "facts"
on in all of my posts. I can not post the actual pages due to copy right
restrictions.

Facts concluded in the research:
1. You need all steel tires E rated tires
2. Any tire larger than Lt225/75R16 can cause severe damage in the case of
air failure or blowout because of the reduced clearance on the coach.

>From my examination of the control arms I believe in an impact the control
arms will bend, and on many of the coaches the intermediate control arm can
be bent from hitting curbs.

Lastly Dick I agree with one part of your post "I don't really think the
tires are one of those but I've seen many times in my career where one 'fix'
creates other problems" In my opinion this usually happens when
do-it-your-selfers think they are better engineers than the designers.

>Tom,
>
>I didn't mean to say there were increased control arm failures but merely
>that there could be. I may have used a poor choice of wording but I was
>merely using that as an example of how anecdotes don't amount to sound
>engineering and that statement would be just as sound as any other isolated
>anecdote is. In that part of the post I wasn't guessing about anything at
>all but I do do some speculation further down. I don't disagree with you
>it's just that we need a well controlled study to reach valid conclusions
>and most of what's been posted here doesn't meet that criteria. I assume
>the Cinnabar article is based on a much larger base of experience than any
>one person could possibly have so is's much more authoritative.
>
>I don't really think the tires are one of those but I've seen many times in
>my career where one 'fix' creates other problems. I've also seen decisions
>made that were based on a misinterpretation of the existing data.
>
>Enjoy
>
>Dick
>
>

>>Dick all you are doing is guessing. Where did you get the idea that there
>>have been control arm failures?
>>
>> why not get the cinnabar July 1999 article on tires for the GMC motorhome
>>due out end of June 1999?
>>

>>>Back about 1980 I had a full size van with Firestone 721 tires on it. These
>>>tires had a manufacturing defect which caused sidewall separation and one
>>>of them actually blew out on me. As I've read all the posts on tires it
>>>makes me wonder if manufacturing defects had anything to do with the GM
>>>recall. Does anyone else have any recollection along these lines? We have
>>>a lot of anecdotes but from reading them I'm not even sure that the GMC has
>>>a tire failure rate which is statistically different from any other
>>>vehicle. This is difficult stuff to get sound data on. Could it be that the
>>>extra weight and stiffness of the 'E' range tires leads to an increased
>>>incidence of control arm failure ;-)
>>>
>>>My coach has been running D range tires for 25 years with no signs of ever
>>>having had a blow out. Nevertheless 'E' range has got to be safer and all
>>>this talk has made me nervous so like several others I'm still trying to
>>>figure out the how and when to switch. (I looked at the 19.5's on a
>>>schoolbus; that's the tire we need. We could jack 'em up like a monster
>>>truck.) Meanwhile there was a thread on alternative 16" steel wheels a few
>>>weeks ago. The thread died with no conclusions. Is there a 16" steel
>>>alternative or are we stuck with only the 16.5's or Alcoa's? Alcoas are
>>>still way down my wish list.
>>>
>>>It could be that all this tire controversy is simply due to the way tires
>>>are rated. I would expect any tire to take the side forces generated by an
>>>emergency steering maneuver so the little bit of extra scuffing generated
>>>by the rear bogeys being a hazard doesn't make sense to me. If the tires
>>>are close enough to max loading that the extra scuffing destroys them then
>>>they're way too close to the edge. Most light trucks are only fully loaded
>>>occasionally while in the RV application we're running at max load all the
>>>time. This makes a tire's life on an RV much tougher than if it were on a
>>>typical light truck. This scenario would lead to the apparent derating
>>>needed for for the GMC.
>>>
>>>Enjoy
>>>
>>>Dick Kennedy
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>Tom & Marg Warner
>>Vernon Center NY
>>1976 palmbeach
>>"The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
>>
>>
>
>
>
Tom & Marg Warner
Vernon Center NY
1976 palmbeach
"The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
 
Arch no such thing as the right answers and don't believe I am gullible
either. I am a professional engineer however, and I would like to think
that I have the ability to evaluate basic information and come to a
conclusion based on my training and experience.
When someone with the credentials of Wes Caughlan supplies me with the kinds
of technical information that he did to back up his opinion, than I listen.
He convinced me that it is not worth the worry to buy lesser tires for a few
dollars saving. You have every right to come to a different conclusion.

>Tom
>
>It must be nice to have the "right" answers----------and to believe them.
>
>Take Care
>Arch 76 GB IL
>
>In a message dated 5/28/99 10:23:04 AM Central Daylight Time, warner
>writes:
>
>> Lastly Dick I agree with one part of your post "I don't really think the
>> tires are one of those but I've seen many times in my career where one
>'fix'
>> creates other problems" In my opinion this usually happens when
>> do-it-your-selfers think they are better engineers than the designers.
>>
>
>
Tom & Marg Warner
Vernon Center NY
1976 palmbeach
"The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
 
Probably the same reason that many 73 and 74 owners did not receive the
recall about the rear pins??? Why don't you send Wes Cauglan an e-mail and ask?

>In a message dated 5/28/99 10:22:44 AM Central Daylight Time, warner
>writes:
>
> that GM had with the General tires failing, that were originally provided on
> the GMC motorhome, and it was done in 1980. Cinnabar did the research for GM
> in an effort to show whether there really was a problem with the bias ply
> tires (there were), what tire should replace them if indeed the research
> showed that there was a problem (there was and Michelins were chosen). >>
>
>Then if my logic is logical, why haven't the owners of '73 & '74 models
>received a recall from GM to replace those non-radial wheels which won't hold
>up under the stress of the required radial tires?? I missed out on the tire
>recall, having ditched my Generals and bought Michelins with my own money,
>and now I've replaced their defective wheels.
>Lanier
>
>
Tom & Marg Warner
Vernon Center NY
1976 palmbeach
"The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
 
Trying to kill this tire myth is like trying to kill a boa constrictor with
a straw. We are talkin about approx $20 per tire to change from D rated
tires to all steel E rated ones. If there is even the slightest chance of
Wes Caulan being right can you really afford to not take his advice? I will
spend $120 any day to avoid a blowout or worse. Wait until you get the bill
for the coach repairs if you ever have a blow out.

Here is what Wes said:
"In the early 1980's GM replaced all of its original equipment
polyester-casing load range D tires with Michelin All-steel load range E
RADIAL tires. It was not in the 1970's."



>
>> Then if my logic is logical, why haven't the owners of '73 & '74 models
>> received a recall from GM to replace those non-radial wheels which won't
>> hold
>> up under the stress of the required radial tires?? I missed out on the
>tire
>> recall, having ditched my Generals and bought Michelins with my own money,
>> and now I've replaced their defective wheels.
>
>Lanier,
> IIRC, the "D" => "E" tire recall involved installing steel-belted BIAS PLY
>load-range E tires, not radials. (Probably not steel-sidewalls either,
>FWIW.) In fact one early recall was to install little stickers reminding
>everyone NOT to mount radials. My '75 has such a sticker in the glovebox.
>So, basically, radial tires were never "required".
>
> It was not until late '75 that radial-ready wheels were used, and some
>time after THAT, that GM "reluctantly" (Wes Coughlin's words) installed
>radial tires. Incidentally, one bulletin I have admonishes the dealers that
>unless the customer uses the lone approved Generel "steel-belted" (not
>all-steel) radial tire, GM would disavow any complaints of harsh ride, poor
>tracking (wiggle), or the like.
>
> As late as 1990, Wes Coughlin, while advocating all-steel radial tires,
>was advising a questioner to go find some bias-ply tires if he really wanted
>to eliminate the tendency to follow the grooves in the highway. (cf: "Coach
>Talk", Sept. 1990, published in the GMC Western States' newsletter, pp. 3-4)
>
> Having thrown my cup of gasoline on the flames, I retire to my fortified
>keyboard to watch the second act of "Tire Wars".
>;-)
>
>Rick Staples
>'75 Eleganza
>Louisville, CO
>
>
Tom & Marg Warner
Vernon Center NY
1976 palmbeach
"The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
 
Tom.
I don't think anyone is realy worried about 20 bucks to go to E's at next
tire change, it's the decision and cost as to when to do that tire change
that's causing us to question as to when the right time is. That's the boa
constrictor some of us have to deal with and sometimes a straw is all we
have :-)

That's the dilema that I am (was) at but I decided to forego my marguarita
allowance on the next couple of trips. Going to pick up my Michelins on
Monday. Of course they won't get put on until next trip as Alcoa replacments
are still 5 weeks away.

The unfortunate part is that every D tire failure will be attributed to the
fact of it simply being D. I firmly believe that the reason we don't hear of
many E failures is simply because there are not as many "old" ones out there
compared to the number of D's out there. What are we going to blame when
the E's start to get old and get used to beyond what they should be in time,
etc. and start to blow?

Heinz

> Trying to kill this tire myth is like trying to kill a boa constrictor
with
> a straw. We are talkin about approx $20 per tire to change from D rated
> tires to all steel E rated ones. If there is even the slightest chance of
> Wes Caulan being right can you really afford to not take his advice? I
will
> spend $120 any day to avoid a blowout or worse. Wait until you get the
bill
> for the coach repairs if you ever have a blow out.
>
>
>
> Here is what Wes said:
> "In the early 1980's GM replaced all of its original equipment
> polyester-casing load range D tires with Michelin All-steel load range E
> RADIAL tires. It was not in the 1970's."
>
>
>

> >
> >> Then if my logic is logical, why haven't the owners of '73 & '74 models
> >> received a recall from GM to replace those non-radial wheels which
won't
> >> hold
> >> up under the stress of the required radial tires?? I missed out on the
> >tire
> >> recall, having ditched my Generals and bought Michelins with my own
money,
> >> and now I've replaced their defective wheels.
> >
> >Lanier,
> > IIRC, the "D" => "E" tire recall involved installing steel-belted BIAS
PLY
> >load-range E tires, not radials. (Probably not steel-sidewalls either,
> >FWIW.) In fact one early recall was to install little stickers reminding
> >everyone NOT to mount radials. My '75 has such a sticker in the
glovebox.
> >So, basically, radial tires were never "required".
> >
> > It was not until late '75 that radial-ready wheels were used, and some
> >time after THAT, that GM "reluctantly" (Wes Coughlin's words) installed
> >radial tires. Incidentally, one bulletin I have admonishes the dealers
that
> >unless the customer uses the lone approved Generel "steel-belted" (not
> >all-steel) radial tire, GM would disavow any complaints of harsh ride,
poor
> >tracking (wiggle), or the like.
> >
> > As late as 1990, Wes Coughlin, while advocating all-steel radial
tires,
> >was advising a questioner to go find some bias-ply tires if he really
wanted
> >to eliminate the tendency to follow the grooves in the highway. (cf:
"Coach
> >Talk", Sept. 1990, published in the GMC Western States' newsletter, pp.
3-4)
> >
> > Having thrown my cup of gasoline on the flames, I retire to my
fortified
> >keyboard to watch the second act of "Tire Wars".
> >;-)
> >
> >Rick Staples
> >'75 Eleganza
> >Louisville, CO
> >
> >
> Tom & Marg Warner
> Vernon Center NY
> 1976 palmbeach
> "The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
>
>
 
Heinz I understand the problem and money is most certainly a factor for
many. It is not easy to shell out $1150 for new alcoas and than another
$1000 for tires. But I have to wonder how many years this problem existed
simply because people were not aware of the problem. for instance the tires
on my coach were over 10 years old, and I did not know it until one of them
blew out.

Now because of this net, we have information available almost instantly. In
the last year I have made it a point when seeing new GMC motorhomes to look
at the tires. I am amazed at how many of them have old tires with little
tread, checked sidewalls, and looking underinflated.

I hope that we have learned that no matter what tire you select, after 3-5
years, replace them.

>Tom.
>I don't think anyone is realy worried about 20 bucks to go to E's at next
>tire change, it's the decision and cost as to when to do that tire change
>that's causing us to question as to when the right time is. That's the boa
>constrictor some of us have to deal with and sometimes a straw is all we
>have :-)
>
>That's the dilema that I am (was) at but I decided to forego my marguarita
>allowance on the next couple of trips. Going to pick up my Michelins on
>Monday. Of course they won't get put on until next trip as Alcoa replacments
>are still 5 weeks away.
>
>The unfortunate part is that every D tire failure will be attributed to the
>fact of it simply being D. I firmly believe that the reason we don't hear of
>many E failures is simply because there are not as many "old" ones out there
>compared to the number of D's out there. What are we going to blame when
>the E's start to get old and get used to beyond what they should be in time,
>etc. and start to blow?
>
>Heinz
>
>
>> Trying to kill this tire myth is like trying to kill a boa constrictor
>with
>> a straw. We are talkin about approx $20 per tire to change from D rated
>> tires to all steel E rated ones. If there is even the slightest chance of
>> Wes Caulan being right can you really afford to not take his advice? I
>will
>> spend $120 any day to avoid a blowout or worse. Wait until you get the
>bill
>> for the coach repairs if you ever have a blow out.
>>
>>
>>
>> Here is what Wes said:
>> "In the early 1980's GM replaced all of its original equipment
>> polyester-casing load range D tires with Michelin All-steel load range E
>> RADIAL tires. It was not in the 1970's."
>>
>>
>>

>> >
>> >> Then if my logic is logical, why haven't the owners of '73 & '74 models
>> >> received a recall from GM to replace those non-radial wheels which
>won't
>> >> hold
>> >> up under the stress of the required radial tires?? I missed out on the
>> >tire
>> >> recall, having ditched my Generals and bought Michelins with my own
>money,
>> >> and now I've replaced their defective wheels.
>> >
>> >Lanier,
>> > IIRC, the "D" => "E" tire recall involved installing steel-belted BIAS
>PLY
>> >load-range E tires, not radials. (Probably not steel-sidewalls either,
>> >FWIW.) In fact one early recall was to install little stickers reminding
>> >everyone NOT to mount radials. My '75 has such a sticker in the
>glovebox.
>> >So, basically, radial tires were never "required".
>> >
>> > It was not until late '75 that radial-ready wheels were used, and some
>> >time after THAT, that GM "reluctantly" (Wes Coughlin's words) installed
>> >radial tires. Incidentally, one bulletin I have admonishes the dealers
>that
>> >unless the customer uses the lone approved Generel "steel-belted" (not
>> >all-steel) radial tire, GM would disavow any complaints of harsh ride,
>poor
>> >tracking (wiggle), or the like.
>> >
>> > As late as 1990, Wes Coughlin, while advocating all-steel radial
>tires,
>> >was advising a questioner to go find some bias-ply tires if he really
>wanted
>> >to eliminate the tendency to follow the grooves in the highway. (cf:
>"Coach
>> >Talk", Sept. 1990, published in the GMC Western States' newsletter, pp.
>3-4)
>> >
>> > Having thrown my cup of gasoline on the flames, I retire to my
>fortified
>> >keyboard to watch the second act of "Tire Wars".
>> >;-)
>> >
>> >Rick Staples
>> >'75 Eleganza
>> >Louisville, CO
>> >
>> >
>> Tom & Marg Warner
>> Vernon Center NY
>> 1976 palmbeach
>> "The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
>>
>>
>
>
>
Tom & Marg Warner
Vernon Center NY
1976 palmbeach
"The beautiful Mohawk Vally"
 
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