Suspension modelling: was Offset Wheels

hdavis

New member
Mar 13, 1998
518
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>You have spent the last umpty upmth posts nitpicking the static load
>equation while others have said yeah but there are even worse problems
>even if you are right about the 1340 up and down vector component
>associated with the weight of the coach.
Even though I'm in the "don't change this one" camp on wheels offest even
more than the alcoas, I respect Zak's desire to have a complete and correct
engineering analysis of the steering components in order to make
an.informed decision regarding wheel offsets on the GMC.
There's a reason why GMC specified the comparatively short service interval
for the front wheels bearings. It may have nothing to do with real bearing
wear. But then it may have everything to do with safety due to wear. I
doubt that we'll ever get access to the design analysis that GM engineers
did in the devlopment of the coach. So, it would be nice to create a
complete and accurate suspension model for those folks who want to make a
fully informed decision on any number of topics: wheels offset, coach
loading, replacement part suitability, and the like.

>
>I am going to contact the author (who was not Wes) and convey your
>concerns about his findings. I bet we hear something like "the 11,190#
>numbers are correct at the extreme ends of each bearing (one up and one
>down) and that is the point where maximum compressive forces are exerted.
The analysis in the newsletter was a general back-of-the-envelope
calculation as far as I'm concerned. It doesn't address a lot of loading
factors. Nor does it tell us anything about the load bearing capabilities
of the suspension components themselves.
Arch went a long way in gathering failure anecdotes recently. They
indicated (logically) that the much-vaunted bearing "problem" didn't appear
to be a problem when the maintenance schedule was performed. IN some cases,
we learned that out of spec bearings can cause problems. Guess that piece
of information shouldn't come as big surprise!
Anybody interested in trying to model the suspension and its dynamic loads?
Henry
Going back to mangling metal brackets for new seats. '76 Palm Beach

Henry Davis Consulting, Inc / new product consulting
PO Box 1270 / product readiness reviews
Soquel, Ca 95073 / IP reviews
ph: (408) 462-5199 / full service marketing
fax: (408) 462-5198
http://www.henry-davis.com/ http://www.henry-davis.com
 
>

>
>Henry >>
>
>Why bother?

1. Because it can help put mythology to rest
2. so that those who want to modify their coach can do so in an informed
manner
3. To permit those who are interested in alternative parts suppliers can
determine the suitability of the replacement parts
4. Because it's interesting

> Get a life! I'm really getting tired of all these postings.

If you have a capable mail reader, you don't need to read those threads.
You can delete them when you read the subject line. You could also add a
filter to filter out messages in the thread.

>We've probably had more time spent on this than any other aspect of the GMC.
>Those who have offset wheels have one opinion and the rest have another and I
>don't think anyone will change either of their opinions.

Modeling the suspension could have other motivations - such as changing the
weight distribution. The OEM configuration was developed under specific
assumptions. I'm interested in a variety of changes to my coach, including
putting some additional house batteries up front. I don't want to do that
if it will materially affect the safety of the front end.

As a last note, I have noticed several folks on the mail list change their
opinions when provided facts. The GMC mail list members in general seem to
be a pretty mature group of people who are interested in maintaining and/or
improving this special vehicle.

Henry

Henry Davis Consulting, Inc / new product consulting
PO Box 1270 / product readiness reviews
Soquel, Ca 95073 / IP reviews
ph: (408) 462-5199 / full service marketing
fax: (408) 462-5198
http://www.henry-davis.com/ http://www.henry-davis.com
 
Henry -
I was hoping you'd step in on this subject. I'd be interested in modeling
what loads are where on the front suspension.
Robin

> ----------
> From: Henry Davis[SMTP:hdavis]
> Reply To: gmcmotorhome
> Sent: Saturday, February 06, 1999 10:00 PM
> To: gmcmotorhome
> Subject: GMC: Suspension modelling: was Re: Offset Wheels
>

> >You have spent the last umpty upmth posts nitpicking the static load
> >equation while others have said yeah but there are even worse problems
> >even if you are right about the 1340 up and down vector component
> >associated with the weight of the coach.
> Even though I'm in the "don't change this one" camp on wheels offest even
> more than the alcoas, I respect Zak's desire to have a complete and
> correct
> engineering analysis of the steering components in order to make
> an.informed decision regarding wheel offsets on the GMC.
> There's a reason why GMC specified the comparatively short service
> interval
> for the front wheels bearings. It may have nothing to do with real bearing
> wear. But then it may have everything to do with safety due to wear. I
> doubt that we'll ever get access to the design analysis that GM engineers
> did in the devlopment of the coach. So, it would be nice to create a
> complete and accurate suspension model for those folks who want to make a
> fully informed decision on any number of topics: wheels offset, coach
> loading, replacement part suitability, and the like.
>
> >
> >I am going to contact the author (who was not Wes) and convey your
> >concerns about his findings. I bet we hear something like "the 11,190#
> >numbers are correct at the extreme ends of each bearing (one up and one
> >down) and that is the point where maximum compressive forces are exerted.
> The analysis in the newsletter was a general back-of-the-envelope
> calculation as far as I'm concerned. It doesn't address a lot of loading
> factors. Nor does it tell us anything about the load bearing capabilities
> of the suspension components themselves.
> Arch went a long way in gathering failure anecdotes recently. They
> indicated (logically) that the much-vaunted bearing "problem" didn't
> appear
> to be a problem when the maintenance schedule was performed. IN some
> cases,
> we learned that out of spec bearings can cause problems. Guess that piece
> of information shouldn't come as big surprise!
> Anybody interested in trying to model the suspension and its dynamic
> loads?
> Henry
> Going back to mangling metal brackets for new seats. '76 Palm Beach
>
> Henry Davis Consulting, Inc / new product consulting
> PO Box 1270 / product readiness reviews
> Soquel, Ca 95073 / IP reviews
> ph: (408) 462-5199 / full service marketing
> fax: (408) 462-5198
> http://www.henry-davis.com/ http://www.henry-davis.com
>