Odd gas tank situation

j artz

New member
Sep 2, 2016
39
0
0
My recently rescued 74 Sequoia 260 came with one fuel tank removed. The PO said the main tank was removed long ago due to a leaky seam, and that was
why the generator doesn't work.

After using a boat tank to bring the coach home, when I crawled under it to drain the 6 year old "gasoline" from the remaining tank it turns out the
main tank is still there, the removed tank was the auxillary. It was removed well before the coach was last used 6 years ago, and sat leaning up
against the outside garage wall ever since. Going to have to start from the ground up on the generator I guess.

Pulled the auxillary tank sender, and the tank was very rusty inside but clean on the outside. Figured it was worth a try to clean it, so went the
muriatic acid route since it's easy to clean and neutralize. Since the tank was supposed to have a seam leak, I laid it flat and poured 1.5 gallons of
pool grade acid in and let it sit a few hours. After finding that it did a great job cleaning the bottom of the tank, I tipped it up on each edge for
a couple of hours to clean further up.

Since one of the seams is supposed to have a leak, I made sure to put some baking soda down so any leak would be obvious and neutralized but nothing
happened. A slight drip where I plugged the fill tube, but no sign of any seam leaks.

So now I'm wondering if one of the hoses on top was actually leaking, and then dripping down to the seam where they saw it. Now that the tank is
rinsed out, I'm planning to put a couple of gallons of gas in and rotate it and check for leaks again. The only other thing I can think of is to take
it to the shop that recored the radiator and have it dipped and leak checked. But if all it needs is cleaning, reinstalling, and all new hoses that'd
definitely be the cheaper way out.

I've read lots of posts on fuel leaks, but most have been from hoses, charcoal canisters, separators, or rusted out tanks. The seams look really
solid, and the exterior surfaces look great. Has anybody run into seam leaks on these tanks?

--
John in Omaha, Nebraska
74 26' Sequoia
 
have not heard much on seams leaking. I would think if you rotate the tank around you could tell if it is going to leak.

just keep an eye on that tank. I was able to clean up an old vw gas tank pretty great with vinegar. I was proud and happy how nice it looked
inside, but when I let it sit about 6 weeks, it rusted quicker and worse then when I started. whoops. I was able to clean it again, but did not
get as clean as the 1st time, so I ended up using por-15 gas tank sealer.

I would think the por-15 gas tank sealer would easily work well to seal the seam on the gmc motorhome gas tank.
--
Jon Roche
75 palm beach
St. Cloud, MN
http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
 
> My recently rescued 74 Sequoia 260 came with one fuel tank removed. The PO said the main tank was removed long ago due to a leaky seam, and that
> was why the generator doesn't work.
>
> After using a boat tank to bring the coach home, when I crawled under it to drain the 6 year old "gasoline" from the remaining tank it turns out
> the main tank is still there, the removed tank was the auxillary. It was removed well before the coach was last used 6 years ago, and sat leaning up
> against the outside garage wall ever since. Going to have to start from the ground up on the generator I guess.
>
> Pulled the auxillary tank sender, and the tank was very rusty inside but clean on the outside. Figured it was worth a try to clean it, so went the
> muriatic acid route since it's easy to clean and neutralize. Since the tank was supposed to have a seam leak, I laid it flat and poured 1.5 gallons
> of pool grade acid in and let it sit a few hours. After finding that it did a great job cleaning the bottom of the tank, I tipped it up on each edge
> for a couple of hours to clean further up.
>
> Since one of the seams is supposed to have a leak, I made sure to put some baking soda down so any leak would be obvious and neutralized but
> nothing happened. A slight drip where I plugged the fill tube, but no sign of any seam leaks.
>
> So now I'm wondering if one of the hoses on top was actually leaking, and then dripping down to the seam where they saw it. Now that the tank is
> rinsed out, I'm planning to put a couple of gallons of gas in and rotate it and check for leaks again. The only other thing I can think of is to
> take it to the shop that recored the radiator and have it dipped and leak checked. But if all it needs is cleaning, reinstalling, and all new hoses
> that'd definitely be the cheaper way out.
>
> I've read lots of posts on fuel leaks, but most have been from hoses, charcoal canisters, separators, or rusted out tanks. The seams look really
> solid, and the exterior surfaces look great. Has anybody run into seam leaks on these tanks?
Gas tanks are available if you can't get yours repaired. http://www.appliedgmc.com/prod.itml/icOid/1634
--
73 23' Sequoia 4 Sale
73 23' CanyonLands Parts Unit 4 Sale
Upper Alabama
"Highest price does not guarantee highest quality."
 
Maybe try a little air pressure (less than 10psi) and some soapy solution on the outside will show leaks that have sealed themselves with corrosion
over the years.
--
Terry Kelpien

ASE Master Technician

73 Glacier 260

Smithfield, Va.
 
> Maybe try a little air pressure (less than 10psi) and some soapy solution on the outside will show leaks that have sealed themselves with
> corrosion over the years.

That was more or less why I decided to try looking for the leak while the muriatic acid was still in there, thinking that it would dissolve any
corrosion that might have built up while the tank sat empty. Probably try the gasoline next, then check to see what the radiator shop gets for a dip
cleaning.

--
John in Omaha, Nebraska
74 26' Sequoia
 
While you've got the tanks down, IMO you should change over to steel fuel lines, at least from the tank sender to the outside of the tank. The you
won't ever have to drop the tanks for gas line replacement again. Just what I would do.
--
Larry
78 Royale w/500 Caddy
Menomonie, WI.
 
I'm not sold on all steel due to lack of stress and vibration relief. I am sold on ONLY using barrier fuel line that is not disolved by ethanol and
will outlast us at this point.
--
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
Source America First
 
pressurize the tank....then check for air bubbles with something that makes bubbles....brian 77 ele

________________________________
From: Gmclist on behalf of J Artz
Sent: October 24, 2016 10:50 AM
To: gmclist
Subject: [GMCnet] Odd gas tank situation

My recently rescued 74 Sequoia 260 came with one fuel tank removed. The PO said the main tank was removed long ago due to a leaky seam, and that was
why the generator doesn't work.

After using a boat tank to bring the coach home, when I crawled under it to drain the 6 year old "gasoline" from the remaining tank it turns out the
main tank is still there, the removed tank was the auxillary. It was removed well before the coach was last used 6 years ago, and sat leaning up
against the outside garage wall ever since. Going to have to start from the ground up on the generator I guess.

Pulled the auxillary tank sender, and the tank was very rusty inside but clean on the outside. Figured it was worth a try to clean it, so went the
muriatic acid route since it's easy to clean and neutralize. Since the tank was supposed to have a seam leak, I laid it flat and poured 1.5 gallons of
pool grade acid in and let it sit a few hours. After finding that it did a great job cleaning the bottom of the tank, I tipped it up on each edge for
a couple of hours to clean further up.

Since one of the seams is supposed to have a leak, I made sure to put some baking soda down so any leak would be obvious and neutralized but nothing
happened. A slight drip where I plugged the fill tube, but no sign of any seam leaks.

So now I'm wondering if one of the hoses on top was actually leaking, and then dripping down to the seam where they saw it. Now that the tank is
rinsed out, I'm planning to put a couple of gallons of gas in and rotate it and check for leaks again. The only other thing I can think of is to take
it to the shop that recored the radiator and have it dipped and leak checked. But if all it needs is cleaning, reinstalling, and all new hoses that'd
definitely be the cheaper way out.

I've read lots of posts on fuel leaks, but most have been from hoses, charcoal canisters, separators, or rusted out tanks. The seams look really
solid, and the exterior surfaces look great. Has anybody run into seam leaks on these tanks?

--
John in Omaha, Nebraska
74 26' Sequoia

_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
Gmclist Info Page - list.gmcnet.orghttp://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
list.gmcnet.org
To see the collection of prior postings to the list, visit the Gmclist Archives. Using Gmclist: To post a message to all the list members, send email ...
 
DO NOT pressurize your tank with air pressure for an air hose, you can do extreme damage to your tank and your self. It is NOT designed as a pressure vessel. If you want to pressurize your tank or tanks switch your shop vac so that it blows out the hose, that way you do not have a very high pressure. When you pressurize your fuel tanks they will expand several inches even with the shop vac, do be carful! I used the shop vac to purge the tanks for several hours to make sure that all the gas and fumes where gone from the tank.

JR Wright
Michigan

>
> pressurize the tank....then check for air bubbles with something that makes bubbles....brian 77 ele
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: Gmclist on behalf of J Artz
> Sent: October 24, 2016 10:50 AM
> To: gmclist
> Subject: [GMCnet] Odd gas tank situation
>
> My recently rescued 74 Sequoia 260 came with one fuel tank removed. The PO said the main tank was removed long ago due to a leaky seam, and that was
> why the generator doesn't work.
>
> After using a boat tank to bring the coach home, when I crawled under it to drain the 6 year old "gasoline" from the remaining tank it turns out the
> main tank is still there, the removed tank was the auxillary. It was removed well before the coach was last used 6 years ago, and sat leaning up
> against the outside garage wall ever since. Going to have to start from the ground up on the generator I guess.
>
> Pulled the auxillary tank sender, and the tank was very rusty inside but clean on the outside. Figured it was worth a try to clean it, so went the
> muriatic acid route since it's easy to clean and neutralize. Since the tank was supposed to have a seam leak, I laid it flat and poured 1.5 gallons of
> pool grade acid in and let it sit a few hours. After finding that it did a great job cleaning the bottom of the tank, I tipped it up on each edge for
> a couple of hours to clean further up.
>
> Since one of the seams is supposed to have a leak, I made sure to put some baking soda down so any leak would be obvious and neutralized but nothing
> happened. A slight drip where I plugged the fill tube, but no sign of any seam leaks.
>
> So now I'm wondering if one of the hoses on top was actually leaking, and then dripping down to the seam where they saw it. Now that the tank is
> rinsed out, I'm planning to put a couple of gallons of gas in and rotate it and check for leaks again. The only other thing I can think of is to take
> it to the shop that recored the radiator and have it dipped and leak checked. But if all it needs is cleaning, reinstalling, and all new hoses that'd
> definitely be the cheaper way out.
>
> I've read lots of posts on fuel leaks, but most have been from hoses, charcoal canisters, separators, or rusted out tanks. The seams look really
> solid, and the exterior surfaces look great. Has anybody run into seam leaks on these tanks?
>
>
>
> --
> John in Omaha, Nebraska
> 74 26' Sequoia
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
> Gmclist Info Page - list.gmcnet.orghttp://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
> list.gmcnet.org
> To see the collection of prior postings to the list, visit the Gmclist Archives. Using Gmclist: To post a message to all the list members, send email ...
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
 
The all steel brake lines lasted a good long while.

-----Original Message-----
From: Gmclist On Behalf Of John R. Lebetski

I'm not sold on all steel due to lack of stress and vibration relief
 
Tonight's update, got the main tank out for cleaning. When both are done they'll go back in with all new hoses.

Think now I know why the generator wouldn't work. The fuel line was attached to a brass fitting on top of the tank, and the 1/4" tube on the side of
the tank was capped by a piece of hose with a bolt stuck in it. Unscrewed the brass fitting, thinking maybe it had a pickup tube. Nope, just a plain
fitting. I doubt the Onan would run on just fumes.

From everything I've read here, the tube part way up the side should be the fuel feed so the generator can't empty the tank, correct? The coach is on
it's third generator, might one of the previous ones had a fuel return? I don't see any other reason for the extra 1/4" hose fitting on top of the
tank.
--
John in Omaha, Nebraska
74 26' Sequoia
 
> Tonight's update, got the main tank out for cleaning. When both are done they'll go back in with all new hoses.
>
> Think now I know why the generator wouldn't work. The fuel line was attached to a brass fitting on top of the tank, and the 1/4" tube on the side
> of the tank was capped by a piece of hose with a bolt stuck in it. Unscrewed the brass fitting, thinking maybe it had a pickup tube. Nope, just a
> plain fitting. I doubt the Onan would run on just fumes.
>
> From everything I've read here, the tube part way up the side should be the fuel feed so the generator can't empty the tank, correct? The coach is
> on it's third generator, might one of the previous ones had a fuel return? I don't see any other reason for the extra 1/4" hose fitting on top of
> the tank.

John,

The intended purpose of the mystery fitting in the side of '73 and some '74 coaches has never been identified.

If there is any fitting in the left rear of the main (rear) tank, that probably was a generator feed at one time. It is quite possible that it had a
pick-up tube in it at one time and that may now be rattling around in the tank. It would be simple (and smart) to solder an new piece in there. I
had to resolder my generator pickup.

Matt
--
Matt & Mary Colie - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
'73 Glacier 23 - Still Loving OE Rear Drum Brake with Applied Control Arms
Now with both true Keyless and remote entry
SE Michigan - Twixt A2 and Detroit
 
John,
Take a look at what I did when rebuilding our fuel tanks. I cleaned and painted the tanks. I did purge them for several hours with a vacuum cleaner set to blow. I used a coated brake line to replace the hoses on top of the tank. Some have used a mechanical fitting to hitch up the fuel and vent lines, but I chose to use a Gates Barrier Hose SAE J30R14 rated hose for the hose connectors with all SS clamps and all my various remaining connection to the fuel system were SAC J30R10 rated hose. These hoses should last a long time as they are rated for the gas that we drive today up to an including E85.

http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/g6928-fuel-tank-system-rebuild.html

JR Wright
Michigan

>
> Tonight's update, got the main tank out for cleaning. When both are done they'll go back in with all new hoses.
>
> Think now I know why the generator wouldn't work. The fuel line was attached to a brass fitting on top of the tank, and the 1/4" tube on the side of
> the tank was capped by a piece of hose with a bolt stuck in it. Unscrewed the brass fitting, thinking maybe it had a pickup tube. Nope, just a plain
> fitting. I doubt the Onan would run on just fumes.
>
> From everything I've read here, the tube part way up the side should be the fuel feed so the generator can't empty the tank, correct? The coach is on
> it's third generator, might one of the previous ones had a fuel return? I don't see any other reason for the extra 1/4" hose fitting on top of the
> tank.
> --
> John in Omaha, Nebraska
> 74 26' Sequoia
 
Sounds like you are on a good path. Get all those fuel lines upgraded and replaced. I would install a new fuel selector valve and tie an electric
fuel pump off your aux feed/aux power off the fuel selector, and you should have fairly mobile coach without much more work.

with the aux pump, you can have the carb primed, and you will notice it fire off without much cranking needed, plus on the few hot days you have
during the summer, you can hit that switch on the dash to aux to overcome the vaporlock.

seems these neglected coaches all need the same stuff. Fuel lines, brake lines, and grease.
--
Jon Roche
75 palm beach
St. Cloud, MN
http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
 
I'm thinking of going to in tank pumps, just a question of finding the right low pressure pumps. Have to rebuild the fuel senders, might as well go
all out. Access doors in the floor sound like a good idea too, there are 8" flush hinged metal doors available for boats that should be perfect. With
access doors in place, the hoses on top of the tank should be fine, it'd be easy enough to pull a new hose through if it would ever be necessary.

Took the sender out this morning, seriously crusty. Soaking in alcohol for the moment, next is a derust bath. Already cleaned up the auxillary sender,
that's when it became obvious the sender needed rebuilding. Even after a thorough cleaning, the resistance values weren't stable.

If that fuel fitting on the side of the main tank was only on the early coaches and never used, the only thing I can think is that while driving, the
fuel slosh would leave the generator sucking fumes. I've got a bore scope, once the tank is rinsed and degassed I'll look inside for a dislodged
pickup tube.
--
John in Omaha, Nebraska
74 26' Sequoia
 
> I'm thinking of going to in tank pumps, just a question of finding the right low pressure pumps. Have to rebuild the fuel senders, might as well
> go all out. ...
Maybe you like DIY. Maybe you can figure out a way to do it for less dollars and dollars are precious to you. My dollars are important to me, but if I
had decided to put in-tank pumps in mine and needed to rebuild the senders, I would take the direct and painless path and buy pre-built from Jim K
instead of reinventing the wheel.

http://www.appliedgmc.com/prod.itml/icOid/1130
--
73 23' Sequoia 4 Sale
73 23' CanyonLands Parts Unit 4 Sale
Upper Alabama
"Highest price does not guarantee highest quality."
 
[/quote]Maybe you like DIY. Maybe you can figure out a way to do it for less dollars and dollars are precious to you. My dollars are important to me,
but if I had decided to put in-tank pumps in mine and needed to rebuild the senders, I would take the direct and painless path and buy pre-built from
Jim K instead of reinventing the wheel.

http://www.appliedgmc.com/prod.itml/icOid/1130[/quote]

I'm very definitely a DIY guy. Been in the auto parts trade for decades, and been repairing, restoring, and modifying cars even longer.

Saw that product, and didn't care for the horizontal pump placement. Plus that doesn't include the senders, which are $185 each. I value my dollars,
and think I can come up with a suitable solution at a lower price. Hopefully I'm right, time will tell.

--
John in Omaha, Nebraska
74 26' Sequoia
 
> The intended purpose of the mystery fitting in the side of '73 and some '74 coaches has never been identified.
>
> If there is any fitting in the left rear of the main (rear) tank, that probably was a generator feed at one time. It is quite possible that it
> had a pick-up tube in it at one time and that may now be rattling around in the tank. It would be simple (and smart) to solder an new piece in
> there. I had to resolder my generator pickup.
>
> Matt

It's purpose has been identified. It is the liquid return fitting for the first try as vapor separation. That system apparently did not work very
well and was replaced with the float system very early on. The tanks spec's or the tanks themselves must have already been finalized. So now that
nipple is on a lot of tanks. I could be used as a fuel return port.

This a picture of that early fuel vapor system.

http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/fuel-tank-r-26amp-3b-r/p13484.html

If you are doing internal tank sealing/ coating make sure the generator pickup tube doesn't become clogged.

--
Steve Southworth
1974 Glacier TZE064V100150 (for workin on)
1975 Transmode TZE365V100394 (parts & spares)
Palmyra WI
 
> Saw that product, and didn't care for the horizontal pump placement. Plus that doesn't include the senders, which are $185 each. I value my
> dollars, and think I can come up with a suitable solution at a lower price. Hopefully I'm right, time will tell.

The horizontal pump was how GM did it on some 60/70 Rivieras and later on Fieros. IMO the horizontal pump orientation is to allow fuel to cool the
pump. In all my factory OEM electric fuel pumps the vertical pump is immersed in a fuel pickup cup that is kept filled by a jet pump.

Here is a picture of the pump. Hit right arrow on picture to see the rest of the story.

http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/gas-tank-rework/p36375-in-tank-fuel-pump-for-carb.html

To see my entire fuel system saga start here:

http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/gas-tank-rework/p35285-gas-tank-rework.html

--
Steve Southworth
1974 Glacier TZE064V100150 (for workin on)
1975 Transmode TZE365V100394 (parts & spares)
Palmyra WI