Installing StatPower TrueCharge40

J

jerry hartley

New member
Aug 26, 1999
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My '76 Royale has two 12 volt batteries, both in the front passenger
side. I may put two 6 volt batteries in for house power, but there is
room up front and all batteries will be installed in the front engine
compartment. I also have an OEM Kohler 6.5 kw gen set which does not
have its own battery. Seems to work fine.

QUESTION - The TrueCharge 40 fits very nicely under the front passenger
seat inside the original EOM enclosed pedestal, about 2' from batteries.
This seems to be an ideal location for installation of the TrueCharge
40. The old buzz box is in the far rear of the coach, requires 26'+ of
wire to connect to batteries. The only apparent disadvantages are the
pedestal is an enclosed steel box which would possibly require cooling
louvers, and the charger could be mounted at a 15 degree angle but not
vertically as instructions direct.

The instructions indicate that the charger should be installed as close
to the ac junction box as possible, and as close to the batteries as
possible.

I would appreciate any advice. Thanks. Jerry Hartley 1976 Royale
 
Jerry

A lot of the experts are on the way/or at the convention. I have not yet
installed a 40, but I have followed the net, in preparation for doing this
job this spring. Your last parpgraph is the answer. Both sources of 120
are in the rear. It might be best if you left your house batteries there
also. I understand the desire to move weight to the front. Some others
that have done this may jump in, but you may also want to wait until the
convention is over and members get home before installing this.

Wayne Newland F9300 75 Palm Beach Columbia, Md

'76 Royale has two 12 volt batteries, both in the front passenger

> side. I may put two 6 volt batteries in for house power, but there is
> room up front and all batteries will be installed in the front engine
> compartment. I also have an OEM Kohler 6.5 kw gen set which does not
> have its own battery. Seems to work fine.
>
> QUESTION - The TrueCharge 40 fits very nicely under the front passenger
> seat inside the original EOM enclosed pedestal, about 2' from batteries.
> This seems to be an ideal location for installation of the TrueCharge
> 40. The old buzz box is in the far rear of the coach, requires 26'+ of
> wire to connect to batteries. The only apparent disadvantages are the
> pedestal is an enclosed steel box which would possibly require cooling
> louvers, and the charger could be mounted at a 15 degree angle but not
> vertically as instructions direct.
>
> The instructions indicate that the charger should be installed as close
> to the ac junction box as possible, and as close to the batteries as
> possible.
>
> I would appreciate any advice. Thanks. Jerry Hartley 1976 Royale
 
I think you have hit upon the only limitation which is the cooling and the
noise from the fan. You will hear when the fan comes on and you may have
to vent the box... I have seen some seat pedestals without doors so you
might just be able to do that. The AC connection is not too critical since
the power load to the AC is low somewhere around 50 watts like a small
light bulb.

Since your batteries are in the front anyway, it is possibly the best place
to mount the charger. The wires will be very short and the charger will be
protected from the weather.

Be sure to leave room the computer for your Howell TBI which I am sure you
will install in the future ;>) It is mounted under this seat also.

gene

>My '76 Royale has two 12 volt batteries, both in the front passenger
>side. I may put two 6 volt batteries in for house power, but there is
>room up front and all batteries will be installed in the front engine
>compartment. I also have an OEM Kohler 6.5 kw gen set which does not
>have its own battery. Seems to work fine.
>
>QUESTION - The TrueCharge 40 fits very nicely under the front passenger
>seat inside the original EOM enclosed pedestal, about 2' from batteries.
>This seems to be an ideal location for installation of the TrueCharge
>40. The old buzz box is in the far rear of the coach, requires 26'+ of
>wire to connect to batteries. The only apparent disadvantages are the
>pedestal is an enclosed steel box which would possibly require cooling
>louvers, and the charger could be mounted at a 15 degree angle but not
>vertically as instructions direct.
>
>The instructions indicate that the charger should be installed as close
>to the ac junction box as possible, and as close to the batteries as
>possible.
>
>I would appreciate any advice. Thanks. Jerry Hartley 1976 Royale
>
Genef -- 77PB/ore/ca
GMC MOTORHOME INFORMATION
mr.erf
http://www.california.com/~eagle/
 
> . The AC connection is not too critical since
> the power load to the AC is low somewhere around 50 watts like a small
> light bulb.

Gene,
I'm not sure that I agree with the power consumption of the TC40
unit that you stated here. I have a TC40 and the manual for it
says on page 20, "the Truecharge 40 will draw a maximum of 12
amperes. The circuit should be protected by a 15 ampere circuit
breaker." 12 amps at 115 volts is 1380 watts. Or about the same
as a hair dryer.

Consequently AC wiring a little more substantial then for a 50
watt bulb should be used for the TC40.

At least this is what I did last Summer.
Richard Waters
'76 PB, Troy, MI
 
Humm that does not seem too efficient,,, but
40 amps at 12 volts is 480 watts
if two batts could be 1000 watts peak.... or about 10 amps on ac some
efficiency loss could get there..... guess could happen

even so, I have a full circuit under the dinette which could handle the
ac.....

If you mount it in the rear, have to run a second large DC wire to the
front unless you have a combiner....

If my Batts were in the front , that is where I would mount it.

thanks for the info

gene

>> . The AC connection is not too critical since
>> the power load to the AC is low somewhere around 50 watts like a small
>> light bulb.
>
>Gene,
>I'm not sure that I agree with the power consumption of the TC40
>unit that you stated here. I have a TC40 and the manual for it
>says on page 20, "the Truecharge 40 will draw a maximum of 12
>amperes. The circuit should be protected by a 15 ampere circuit
>breaker." 12 amps at 115 volts is 1380 watts. Or about the same
>as a hair dryer.
>
>Consequently AC wiring a little more substantial then for a 50
>watt bulb should be used for the TC40.
>
>At least this is what I did last Summer.
>Richard Waters
>'76 PB, Troy, MI
>
>
>
>
Genef -- 77PB/ore/ca
GMC MOTORHOME INFORMATION
mr.erf
http://www.california.com/~eagle/
 
>
> Presumably your 12 VDC distribution buss is at the rear, near the "buzz box".
> The maximum possible load through that buss is probably 40+ A. With that in
> mind, what does it matter whether you send up to 40 A foward to the batteries
> or 40 A aft to the buss? It would certainly be simpler to mount the TC40 in
> the rear and you won't have to run 120 vac forward (under the coach???).
>

Maybe I worried to much about what the TC40 manual said when I installed
mine last Summer. The manual on pages 15 and 16 state under item e that
it should be installed "Close to AC junction box - avoid the use of extended wire

lengths if possible." That put it in the cabinet where the old "buzz box"
was located.

And item F states "Close to battery/batteries - avoid excessive cable lengths.
Use the recommended wire lengths and size." The instructions also go on
to say that you are supposed to "run the battery leads directly to the charger
battery terminals." The wiring in the 12 VDC distribution buss near the
"buzz box" is not heavy enough for the output of the TC40. It was
apparently adequate for the old buzz box. I ran 2 6AWG cables from
the TC40 directly to the house batteries. I did that because the manual has
a chart on page 17 that shows the wire size for the TC40 with a total cable
run of 15-20' is 6AWG (that's the total of both cables).
Richard Waters
'76 PB, Troy, MI
 
> Humm that does not seem too efficient,,, but
> 40 amps at 12 volts is 480 watts
> if two batts could be 1000 watts peak.... or about 10 amps on ac some
> efficiency loss could get there..... guess could happen
>

The manual states the efficiency for the unit is 85%. The manual also
says that the maximum continious output is 40 amps. 40 amps at close
to 15 volts is only 600 watts. Factor in the efficiency of 85% and
you have about 700 watts. Maybe the fan uses the rest? Maybe a typo
in the manual as all that doesn't really add up to 12 amps.
use
Richard
 
You're struggling with a statpower and i'm frustrated with the inverter.
came with coach and Buskirk (Max) and I cannot get shore power to operate.
Only way to power coach is through battery. There should be a switch that
transfers power when using shore power. Getting real close to yanking the
whole thing out and going to a converter.

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Waters
To:
Sent: Thursday, March 16, 2000 10:39 PM
Subject: Re: GMC: Installing StatPower TrueCharge40

> > Humm that does not seem too efficient,,, but
> > 40 amps at 12 volts is 480 watts
> > if two batts could be 1000 watts peak.... or about 10 amps on ac some
> > efficiency loss could get there..... guess could happen
> >
>
> The manual states the efficiency for the unit is 85%. The manual also
> says that the maximum continious output is 40 amps. 40 amps at close
> to 15 volts is only 600 watts. Factor in the efficiency of 85% and
> you have about 700 watts. Maybe the fan uses the rest? Maybe a typo
> in the manual as all that doesn't really add up to 12 amps.
> use
> Richard
>
>
 
Robert,

What brand of inverter are you having problems with?

Patrick

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Robert Neeb [mailto:Rneeb]
> Sent: Friday, March 17, 2000 11:05 AM
> To: gmcmotorhome
> Subject: Re: GMC: Installing StatPower TrueCharge40
>
>
> You're struggling with a statpower and i'm frustrated with
> the inverter.
> came with coach and Buskirk (Max) and I cannot get shore
> power to operate.
> Only way to power coach is through battery. There should be
> a switch that
> transfers power when using shore power. Getting real close
> to yanking the
> whole thing out and going to a converter.
 
Patrick,
I have a trace engineering 2012 inverter. Talked to Trace and they're not
much help to a non electrical person like me.

- ----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Friday, March 17, 2000 11:21 AM
Subject: RE: GMC: Installing StatPower TrueCharge40

> Robert,
>
> What brand of inverter are you having problems with?
>
> Patrick
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Robert Neeb [mailto:Rneeb]
> > Sent: Friday, March 17, 2000 11:05 AM
> > To: gmcmotorhome
> > Subject: Re: GMC: Installing StatPower TrueCharge40
> >
> >
> > You're struggling with a statpower and i'm frustrated with
> > the inverter.
> > came with coach and Buskirk (Max) and I cannot get shore
> > power to operate.
> > Only way to power coach is through battery. There should be
> > a switch that
> > transfers power when using shore power. Getting real close
> > to yanking the
> > whole thing out and going to a converter.
>
 
Robert,

Their web site isn't a lot of help either. I was hoping to find some tech
info there that might help you. They didn't have a manual online for your
model, although I did find:

http://www.traceengineering.com/document_depot/manuals/3178UX-L-TRevNew.pdf

which is for a similar unit. If you have a manual, check to make sure that
the incoming AC is wired correctly. Also check for a "pass-thru" AC
breaker(but if you're getting AC out of the unit when running on battery,
this is probably not the problem).

Also, don't overlook the obvious - do you have 110VAC into the inverter and
is the polarity correct?

Good luck,
Patrick

>
> Patrick,
> I have a trace engineering 2012 inverter. Talked to Trace
> and they're not much help to a non electrical person like me.
>
>
> > Robert,
> >
> > What brand of inverter are you having problems with?
> >
> > Patrick
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Robert Neeb [mailto:Rneeb]
> > > Sent: Friday, March 17, 2000 11:05 AM
> > > To: gmcmotorhome
> > > Subject: Re: GMC: Installing StatPower TrueCharge40
> > >
> > > You're struggling with a statpower and i'm frustrated with
> > > the inverter. came with coach and Buskirk (Max) and I
> > > cannot get shore power to operate. Only way to power
> > > coach is through battery. There should be a switch that
> > > transfers power when using shore power. Getting real close
> > > to yanking the whole thing out and going to a converter.
 
I found specs for the model I have. It was in the old model section. I can
trace the power to the inverter back to the circuit breaker it is attached
to. The breaker works properly. When I turn it off the inverter shuts
down. The crazy part is if I use the generator it recognizes AC and works
fine. But the moment I convert to shore power, whether the inverter is
powered up or down it doesn't recognize AC.
- ----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Friday, March 17, 2000 12:55 PM
Subject: RE: GMC: Installing StatPower TrueCharge40

> Robert,
>
> Their web site isn't a lot of help either. I was hoping to find some tech
> info there that might help you. They didn't have a manual online for your
> model, although I did find:
>
>
http://www.traceengineering.com/document_depot/manuals/3178UX-L-TRevNew.pdf
>
> which is for a similar unit. If you have a manual, check to make sure
that
> the incoming AC is wired correctly. Also check for a "pass-thru" AC
> breaker(but if you're getting AC out of the unit when running on battery,
> this is probably not the problem).
>
> Also, don't overlook the obvious - do you have 110VAC into the inverter
and
> is the polarity correct?
>
> Good luck,
> Patrick
>

> >
> > Patrick,
> > I have a trace engineering 2012 inverter. Talked to Trace
> > and they're not much help to a non electrical person like me.
> >
> >
> > > Robert,
> > >
> > > What brand of inverter are you having problems with?
> > >
> > > Patrick
> > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: Robert Neeb [mailto:Rneeb]
> > > > Sent: Friday, March 17, 2000 11:05 AM
> > > > To: gmcmotorhome
> > > > Subject: Re: GMC: Installing StatPower TrueCharge40
> > > >
> > > > You're struggling with a statpower and i'm frustrated with
> > > > the inverter. came with coach and Buskirk (Max) and I
> > > > cannot get shore power to operate. Only way to power
> > > > coach is through battery. There should be a switch that
> > > > transfers power when using shore power. Getting real close
> > > > to yanking the whole thing out and going to a converter.
>
 
>
>
> I found specs for the model I have. It was in the old model
> section.

OK, I got it now.

> I can trace the power to the inverter back to the circuit
> breaker it is attached to. The breaker works properly. When
> I turn it off the inverter shuts down.

Bear with me here. Are you saying you have 110V to the input terminals as
shown on page 12 or that you have 12V(not sure what you mean by "inverter
shuts down" when you turn off the breaker)?

> The crazy part is if I use the generator it recognizes
> AC and works fine. But the moment I convert to shore
> power, whether the inverter is powered up or down it
> doesn't recognize AC.

That sounds like the problem is not the inverter. The automatic transfer
switch in the inverter toggles the circuit between "pass-thru" and inverter
operation depending on whether 110V is present or not. The source of 110V
shouldn't make a difference. How does the coach load switch between shore
and generator? You may have another automatic transfer switch somewhere
else. However, this should prevent having 110V at the terminal strip of the
inverter whenever the generator wasn't running. Be sure you have 110V at
that terminal strip without the generator running. If you don't, the
problem's not in the inverter and you need to look upstream for another
switch.

Keep the info coming and maybe we can beat this one.

Patrick
 
HI Robert

Could you explain exactly where you have the AC input to the inverter connected and where the output
is connected.

The transfer relay in the inverter is only good for 30 amps, the Onan can produce 50 amps. Are you
using an external transfer relay?

When using shore power you have a +110 volt and a -110 volt bus in the breaker panel. The inverter
will feed only one of these busses unless you have a transfer relay that connects the two busses
together. They are connected in the Onan power receptacle so the Onan can feed both.

If I understand the Trace drawings you should have the inverter installed between the power cord and
the breaker box. The ground, neutral, and one of the power leads (let's assume red) should go
straight to the breaker box. The other power lead (black) should go to a fuse or breaker, then to
the inverter AC in. The AC out of the inverter should then go to the breaker box where the black
lead was originally connected. You of course will need to connect the ground and neutral leads to
the inverter as well.

The inverter should probably be connected to the bus not feeding the air conditioner.

If you do not understand the Trace drawings you should get help from an electrician, preferably one
familiar with RV wiring systems. Your life could depend on it.

Dave Mumert
dave

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Neeb"
To:
Sent: March 17, 2000 11:28 AM
Subject: Re: GMC: Installing StatPower TrueCharge40

> I found specs for the model I have. It was in the old model section. I can
> trace the power to the inverter back to the circuit breaker it is attached
> to. The breaker works properly. When I turn it off the inverter shuts
> down. The crazy part is if I use the generator it recognizes AC and works
> fine. But the moment I convert to shore power, whether the inverter is
> powered up or down it doesn't recognize AC.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From:
> To:
> Sent: Friday, March 17, 2000 12:55 PM
> Subject: RE: GMC: Installing StatPower TrueCharge40
>
>
> > Robert,
> >
> > Their web site isn't a lot of help either. I was hoping to find some tech
> > info there that might help you. They didn't have a manual online for your
> > model, although I did find:
> >
> >
> http://www.traceengineering.com/document_depot/manuals/3178UX-L-TRevNew.pdf
> >
> > which is for a similar unit. If you have a manual, check to make sure
> that
> > the incoming AC is wired correctly. Also check for a "pass-thru" AC
> > breaker(but if you're getting AC out of the unit when running on battery,
> > this is probably not the problem).
> >
> > Also, don't overlook the obvious - do you have 110VAC into the inverter
> and
> > is the polarity correct?
> >
> > Good luck,
> > Patrick
> >

> > >
> > > Patrick,
> > > I have a trace engineering 2012 inverter. Talked to Trace
> > > and they're not much help to a non electrical person like me.
> > >
> > >
> > > > Robert,
> > > >
> > > > What brand of inverter are you having problems with?
> > > >
> > > > Patrick
> > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: Robert Neeb [mailto:Rneeb]
> > > > > Sent: Friday, March 17, 2000 11:05 AM
> > > > > To: gmcmotorhome
> > > > > Subject: Re: GMC: Installing StatPower TrueCharge40
> > > > >
> > > > > You're struggling with a statpower and i'm frustrated with
> > > > > the inverter. came with coach and Buskirk (Max) and I
> > > > > cannot get shore power to operate. Only way to power
> > > > > coach is through battery. There should be a switch that
> > > > > transfers power when using shore power. Getting real close
> > > > > to yanking the whole thing out and going to a converter.
> >
>
 
Thanks Pat and Dave.
I will go do some checking after work today and get back with you. I
apologize for the lack of knowledge but I bought the coach this fall and
have not done anything to speak of with it yet. I have been busy changing
the price of gas, since I am a petroleum jobber by profession... Although
wish I was an electrician, as there seems to be a need for them, and the
money they make is sure better than the fuel business.
- ----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Friday, March 17, 2000 2:25 PM
Subject: RE: GMC: Installing StatPower TrueCharge40

>

> >
> >
> > I found specs for the model I have. It was in the old model
> > section.
>
> OK, I got it now.
>
> > I can trace the power to the inverter back to the circuit
> > breaker it is attached to. The breaker works properly. When
> > I turn it off the inverter shuts down.
>
> Bear with me here. Are you saying you have 110V to the input terminals as
> shown on page 12 or that you have 12V(not sure what you mean by "inverter
> shuts down" when you turn off the breaker)?
>
> > The crazy part is if I use the generator it recognizes
> > AC and works fine. But the moment I convert to shore
> > power, whether the inverter is powered up or down it
> > doesn't recognize AC.
>
> That sounds like the problem is not the inverter. The automatic transfer
> switch in the inverter toggles the circuit between "pass-thru" and
inverter
> operation depending on whether 110V is present or not. The source of 110V
> shouldn't make a difference. How does the coach load switch between shore
> and generator? You may have another automatic transfer switch somewhere
> else. However, this should prevent having 110V at the terminal strip of
the
> inverter whenever the generator wasn't running. Be sure you have 110V at
> that terminal strip without the generator running. If you don't, the
> problem's not in the inverter and you need to look upstream for another
> switch.
>
> Keep the info coming and maybe we can beat this one.
>
> Patrick
>
 
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