Amazingly my main interest in an aluminum manifold was that I needed to pull out the stock iron manifold. And didn't want to put that heavy thing back on. Now this idea has brought up some other issue when installing EFI on my 403. And these same issue would be involved with an iron, or aluminum manifold anyway. You have to install a 3/8 inch adapter to mount the TB. And I don't like the turbulence that is creates due to the adapters alignment with the intakes carb ports. I want to uses the stock air filter. The adapter moves the air filter into the distributor. So I'm thinking of machining out the aluminum intake were the 4 holes are for the carb ports. Then weld in an aluminum 3/8ths inch mount down in the manifold for the TB. Thus this will lower the TB. Then I can move the TB to were I want it to be. Bob Dunahugh 78 Royale Mouse House
Got an Olds 307 aluminum intake manifold coming Thursday for my 403
- Thread starter Bob Dunahugh
- Start date
carb ports. Then weld in an aluminum 3/8ths inch mount down in the manifold for the TB. Thus this will lower the TB. Then I can move the TB to were I
want it to be. Bob Dunahugh 78 Royale Mouse House
[/quote]
That is doable Bob but I'd caution you to find a really good welder. Due to the expansion of aluminum as it heats, I'd be concerned about getting a
good weld that doesn't have porosity and cracks. Can you say
'vacuum leaks'?
--
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
77 Eleganza II, 403CI, Manny Brakes, 1 ton, tranny, lots of aluminum goodies.
http://www.bdub.net/pinkerton/
'03 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
want it to be. Bob Dunahugh 78 Royale Mouse House
[/quote]
That is doable Bob but I'd caution you to find a really good welder. Due to the expansion of aluminum as it heats, I'd be concerned about getting a
good weld that doesn't have porosity and cracks. Can you say
'vacuum leaks'?
--
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
77 Eleganza II, 403CI, Manny Brakes, 1 ton, tranny, lots of aluminum goodies.
http://www.bdub.net/pinkerton/
'03 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
Couldn't you heat the manifold and adapter in an oven before welding, and weld them at an elevated temperature?
--johnny
--
'76 23' transmode Norris upfit, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
"The road goes on forever, and the party never ends" --Robert Earl Keen
--johnny
--
'76 23' transmode Norris upfit, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
"The road goes on forever, and the party never ends" --Robert Earl Keen
I'd worry about distortion of the manifold......
And not all grades of aluminium are weldable and since it conducts heat away so fast you really need to heat the whole part up to get a good weld in
any case.....
Pete
--
Cary, NC
No Coach yet but likely center kitchen, dry side bath Royale, 78, 403, hopefully with good original white Imron paint.
And not all grades of aluminium are weldable and since it conducts heat away so fast you really need to heat the whole part up to get a good weld in
any case.....
Pete
--
Cary, NC
No Coach yet but likely center kitchen, dry side bath Royale, 78, 403, hopefully with good original white Imron paint.
Welded lots of castings. Cylinder heads sand cast in aluminum, similar
intake manifolds. Castings need to be squeaky clean. Preheat the whole
casting in an oven to 400° F, and rest it on fire bricks, as flat as
possible. Weld while the casting is as hot as possible, when finished, put
it back into the oven, and gradually lower Temps 100° at a time. Cool
slowly out of drafts. Not saying this will eliminate warping, just minimize
it. Some mating surfaces may require machine work following welding. No
fool proof method exists for prevention.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 GMC ROYALE 403
> I'd worry about distortion of the manifold......
> And not all grades of aluminium are weldable and since it conducts heat
> away so fast you really need to heat the whole part up to get a good weld in
> any case.....
>
> Pete
>
> --
> Cary, NC
>
> No Coach yet but likely center kitchen, dry side bath Royale, 78, 403,
> hopefully with good original white Imron paint.
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
intake manifolds. Castings need to be squeaky clean. Preheat the whole
casting in an oven to 400° F, and rest it on fire bricks, as flat as
possible. Weld while the casting is as hot as possible, when finished, put
it back into the oven, and gradually lower Temps 100° at a time. Cool
slowly out of drafts. Not saying this will eliminate warping, just minimize
it. Some mating surfaces may require machine work following welding. No
fool proof method exists for prevention.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Or
78 GMC ROYALE 403
> I'd worry about distortion of the manifold......
> And not all grades of aluminium are weldable and since it conducts heat
> away so fast you really need to heat the whole part up to get a good weld in
> any case.....
>
> Pete
>
> --
> Cary, NC
>
> No Coach yet but likely center kitchen, dry side bath Royale, 78, 403,
> hopefully with good original white Imron paint.
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
> That is doable Bob but I'd caution you to find a really good welder. Due to the expansion of aluminum as it heats, I'd be concerned about getting
> a good weld that doesn't have porosity and cracks. Can you say
> 'vacuum leaks'?
Kerry,
While your fear of porosity is valid, there is readily available treatment for it. Casting companies do it all the time. They dip or spray the
casting with a stuff most like superglue (alpha cyanoacrylate family) that wicks into all the small places and cures. The easy way I have used is to
use plates and tape and draw a vacuum on the part and then brush or spray on the Loctite stuff (that I stole from work).
As Jim said, it can be done as a Hot Weld process too, but that is a whole lot like no fun.
Matt
--
Matt & Mary Colie - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
'73 Glacier 23 - Still Loving OE Rear Drum Brake with Applied Control Arms
Now with both true Keyless and remote entry
SE Michigan - Twixt A2 and Detroit
> a good weld that doesn't have porosity and cracks. Can you say
> 'vacuum leaks'?
Kerry,
While your fear of porosity is valid, there is readily available treatment for it. Casting companies do it all the time. They dip or spray the
casting with a stuff most like superglue (alpha cyanoacrylate family) that wicks into all the small places and cures. The easy way I have used is to
use plates and tape and draw a vacuum on the part and then brush or spray on the Loctite stuff (that I stole from work).
As Jim said, it can be done as a Hot Weld process too, but that is a whole lot like no fun.
Matt
--
Matt & Mary Colie - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
'73 Glacier 23 - Still Loving OE Rear Drum Brake with Applied Control Arms
Now with both true Keyless and remote entry
SE Michigan - Twixt A2 and Detroit
When we did cylinder heads and cases at Mac's, we took them up to 400 - 450 in the oven and then gave them to the welders. Back in the oven to cool
slowly overnight. All the welds were going to be machined anyway, warpage wasn't a great problem. It did take a welder who knew what he was doing
(not me), all done in Heliarc.
--johnny
--
'76 23' transmode Norris upfit, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
"The road goes on forever, and the party never ends" --Robert Earl Keen
slowly overnight. All the welds were going to be machined anyway, warpage wasn't a great problem. It did take a welder who knew what he was doing
(not me), all done in Heliarc.
--johnny
--
'76 23' transmode Norris upfit, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
"The road goes on forever, and the party never ends" --Robert Earl Keen
All good points. Like I said it is doable but it ain't 'trivial' and needs the attention of someone who knows what they are doing. That is, not the
neighborhood jackleg with a Chinese TIG.
--
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
77 Eleganza II, 403CI, Manny Brakes, 1 ton, tranny, lots of aluminum goodies.
http://www.bdub.net/pinkerton/
'03 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
neighborhood jackleg with a Chinese TIG.
--
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
77 Eleganza II, 403CI, Manny Brakes, 1 ton, tranny, lots of aluminum goodies.
http://www.bdub.net/pinkerton/
'03 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
Just found a 3711 in the shed
Len and Pat Novak
1978 GMC Kingsley
The Beast II with dash lights that work and labels you can see!
Fallbrook, CA new email: B52Rule
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showgallery.php?cat=4375
www.bdub.net/novak/
-----Original Message-----
From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces] On Behalf Of Bob
Dunahugh
Sent: Saturday, January 07, 2017 6:57 PM
To: gmclist
Subject: [GMCnet] Got an Olds 307 aluminum intake manifold coming Thursday
for my 403
Amazingly my main interest in an aluminum manifold was that I needed to pull
out the stock iron manifold. And didn't want to put that heavy thing back
on. Now this idea has brought up some other issue when installing EFI on my
403. And these same issue would be involved with an iron, or aluminum
manifold anyway. You have to install a 3/8 inch adapter to mount the TB.
And I don't like the turbulence that is creates due to the adapters
alignment with the intakes carb ports. I want to uses the stock air filter.
The adapter moves the air filter into the distributor. So I'm thinking of
machining out the aluminum intake were the 4 holes are for the carb ports.
Then weld in an aluminum 3/8ths inch mount down in the manifold for the TB.
Thus this will lower the TB. Then I can move the TB to were I want it to be.
Bob Dunahugh 78 Royale Mouse House
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7996 / Virus Database: 4749/13726 - Release Date: 01/07/17
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7996 / Virus Database: 4749/13726 - Release Date: 01/07/17
Len and Pat Novak
1978 GMC Kingsley
The Beast II with dash lights that work and labels you can see!
Fallbrook, CA new email: B52Rule
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/showgallery.php?cat=4375
www.bdub.net/novak/
-----Original Message-----
From: Gmclist [mailto:gmclist-bounces] On Behalf Of Bob
Dunahugh
Sent: Saturday, January 07, 2017 6:57 PM
To: gmclist
Subject: [GMCnet] Got an Olds 307 aluminum intake manifold coming Thursday
for my 403
Amazingly my main interest in an aluminum manifold was that I needed to pull
out the stock iron manifold. And didn't want to put that heavy thing back
on. Now this idea has brought up some other issue when installing EFI on my
403. And these same issue would be involved with an iron, or aluminum
manifold anyway. You have to install a 3/8 inch adapter to mount the TB.
And I don't like the turbulence that is creates due to the adapters
alignment with the intakes carb ports. I want to uses the stock air filter.
The adapter moves the air filter into the distributor. So I'm thinking of
machining out the aluminum intake were the 4 holes are for the carb ports.
Then weld in an aluminum 3/8ths inch mount down in the manifold for the TB.
Thus this will lower the TB. Then I can move the TB to were I want it to be.
Bob Dunahugh 78 Royale Mouse House
_______________________________________________
GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7996 / Virus Database: 4749/13726 - Release Date: 01/07/17
-----
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2016.0.7996 / Virus Database: 4749/13726 - Release Date: 01/07/17
Len. That 3711 has the carb mounting surface that's about .5 of an inch higher then our 403 iron intake. I'd like to know if that info is correct. Can you check that. And see if that much could be machined off. The Montello shop says that the 3711 is fine for a 403 in a GMC as is. Bob Dunahugh
________________________________
From: Bob Dunahugh
Sent: Saturday, January 7, 2017 8:57 PM
To: gmclist
Subject: Got an Olds 307 aluminum intake manifold coming Thursday for my 403
Amazingly my main interest in an aluminum manifold was that I needed to pull out the stock iron manifold. And didn't want to put that heavy thing back on. Now this idea has brought up some other issue when installing EFI on my 403. And these same issue would be involved with an iron, or aluminum manifold anyway. You have to install a 3/8 inch adapter to mount the TB. And I don't like the turbulence that is creates due to the adapters alignment with the intakes carb ports. I want to uses the stock air filter. The adapter moves the air filter into the distributor. So I'm thinking of machining out the aluminum intake were the 4 holes are for the carb ports. Then weld in an aluminum 3/8ths inch mount down in the manifold for the TB. Thus this will lower the TB. Then I can move the TB to were I want it to be. Bob Dunahugh 78 Royale Mouse House
________________________________
From: Bob Dunahugh
Sent: Saturday, January 7, 2017 8:57 PM
To: gmclist
Subject: Got an Olds 307 aluminum intake manifold coming Thursday for my 403
Amazingly my main interest in an aluminum manifold was that I needed to pull out the stock iron manifold. And didn't want to put that heavy thing back on. Now this idea has brought up some other issue when installing EFI on my 403. And these same issue would be involved with an iron, or aluminum manifold anyway. You have to install a 3/8 inch adapter to mount the TB. And I don't like the turbulence that is creates due to the adapters alignment with the intakes carb ports. I want to uses the stock air filter. The adapter moves the air filter into the distributor. So I'm thinking of machining out the aluminum intake were the 4 holes are for the carb ports. Then weld in an aluminum 3/8ths inch mount down in the manifold for the TB. Thus this will lower the TB. Then I can move the TB to were I want it to be. Bob Dunahugh 78 Royale Mouse House
> That is, not the neighborhood jackleg with a Chinese TIG.
I had to look up what a jackleg was and found it was me and I use a Chinese tig too! Where did that word come from? If I had a extra manifold I'd sure
give it a try, maybe test a spot before to see how it seemed to weld. Injector and NOS spray ports get tigged in alum manifolds so it can't be
hopeless.
--
Wally Anderson
Omaha NE
75 Glenbrook
Megasquirt III injection
Bob Stone hydroBOOOOST
Manny reaction arm system
Branscombe Kelsey Hayes park brake
http://wallyandsue.blogspot.com/
I had to look up what a jackleg was and found it was me and I use a Chinese tig too! Where did that word come from? If I had a extra manifold I'd sure
give it a try, maybe test a spot before to see how it seemed to weld. Injector and NOS spray ports get tigged in alum manifolds so it can't be
hopeless.
--
Wally Anderson
Omaha NE
75 Glenbrook
Megasquirt III injection
Bob Stone hydroBOOOOST
Manny reaction arm system
Branscombe Kelsey Hayes park brake
http://wallyandsue.blogspot.com/
Yes, Kerry,
I resemble that allegation, but don't have a TIG. I think really compared, to you Kerry, there are loads of jacklegs driving and modifying GMCs and
having a ball! No offense taken.
Good to hear from you even though you drive a non-GMC. How is it going with that unit?
Carey
--
Carey from Ennis, Texas
78 Royale, 500 Cadillac, Rance Baxter EFI.
I resemble that allegation, but don't have a TIG. I think really compared, to you Kerry, there are loads of jacklegs driving and modifying GMCs and
having a ball! No offense taken.
Good to hear from you even though you drive a non-GMC. How is it going with that unit?
Carey
--
Carey from Ennis, Texas
78 Royale, 500 Cadillac, Rance Baxter EFI.
> Yes, Kerry,
>
> I resemble that allegation, but don't have a TIG. I think really compared, to you Kerry, there are loads of jacklegs driving and modifying GMCs
> and having a ball! No offense taken.
>
> Good to hear from you even though you drive a non-GMC. How is it going with that unit?
>
> Carey
I wouldn't classify you as a jackleg either Wally. But while I might try this on my own coach, I certainly wouldn't do it on anyone elses.
I learned something about the definition of Jackleg also. I always thought it meant someone not trained or very skilled, ie amateur, basically, the
equivalent to a not very good shadetree mechanic. However, another definition is "characterized by unscrupulousness, dishonesty, or lack of
professional standards " I certainly was not comparing anyone here to the dishonest definition.
That said, we all know the guy in the area who can stick metal together even if it looks like bubble gum. That's a jackleg welder.
--
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
77 Eleganza II, 403CI, Manny Brakes, 1 ton, tranny, lots of aluminum goodies.
http://www.bdub.net/pinkerton/
'03 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
>
> I resemble that allegation, but don't have a TIG. I think really compared, to you Kerry, there are loads of jacklegs driving and modifying GMCs
> and having a ball! No offense taken.
>
> Good to hear from you even though you drive a non-GMC. How is it going with that unit?
>
> Carey
I wouldn't classify you as a jackleg either Wally. But while I might try this on my own coach, I certainly wouldn't do it on anyone elses.
I learned something about the definition of Jackleg also. I always thought it meant someone not trained or very skilled, ie amateur, basically, the
equivalent to a not very good shadetree mechanic. However, another definition is "characterized by unscrupulousness, dishonesty, or lack of
professional standards " I certainly was not comparing anyone here to the dishonest definition.
That said, we all know the guy in the area who can stick metal together even if it looks like bubble gum. That's a jackleg welder.
--
Kerry Pinkerton - North Alabama
77 Eleganza II, 403CI, Manny Brakes, 1 ton, tranny, lots of aluminum goodies.
http://www.bdub.net/pinkerton/
'03 Fleetwood Discovery 39L
Hey,
Y'All quit talkin' about me! At least my stuff gets to the REAL welder
assembled (sometimes).
Ken H.
On Mon, Jan 9, 2017 at 8:28 PM, Kerry Pinkerton
wrote:
>
> That said, we all know the guy in the area who can stick metal together
> even if it looks like bubble gum. That's a jackleg welder.
>
Y'All quit talkin' about me! At least my stuff gets to the REAL welder
assembled (sometimes).
Ken H.
On Mon, Jan 9, 2017 at 8:28 PM, Kerry Pinkerton
wrote:
>
> That said, we all know the guy in the area who can stick metal together
> even if it looks like bubble gum. That's a jackleg welder.
>
