Frozen rear hub/drum solution needed

T

tyler

Active member
Jun 22, 2013
518
98
28
Nearing the time to hear and see the 78 run and move. Carb and intake manifold service/fix nearly done. All new front brakes, front brake lines and
master cylinder. I pulled the rear hub/drums to check brakes and bearings. Three came off with medium effort. Bearings looked pretty good, and all had
pretty clean, if old and stiff, grease. Passenger rear will not turn. I have blocked under it (to not put torque load on shock absorber), put lugnuts
on backwards to protect threads, spanned with a crowbar and jacked the crowbar. Nothing. I beat it with a larger than average hammer. Nothing. PO had
a drilled out 2x8 board that fit the lug circle about three feet long, tried that with the jack. Nothing. It seems like the brake shoes are frozen to
the drum.

I have a replacement brake drum available (not hub), and brake shoes.

Can I drill the top of the drum to let PB Blaster run down the shoes.
Will I have to cut the drum itself with an angle grinder?

I thought about putting all the wheels on, and with the wheels on the ground try to move the coach and pop it free. After the two levered jacking
attempts i think it will just drag that wheel.

Suggestions please...
--
1975 Glenbrook, 1978 Royale rear bath
Raleigh, NC
 
You might try backing the shoes off. Knock plugs out if there. Spray knocker loose stuff in the hole. Use a thin screwdriver thru the hole and push
the lever away from star adjuster. At same time use a bigger screwdriver to lever turn the adjuster down. Might also try smacking the outside of the
drum.

> Nearing the time to hear and see the 78 run and move. Carb and intake manifold service/fix nearly done. All new front brakes, front brake lines
> and master cylinder. I pulled the rear hub/drums to check brakes and bearings. Three came off with medium effort. Bearings looked pretty good, and
> all had pretty clean, if old and stiff, grease. Passenger rear will not turn. I have blocked under it (to not put torque load on shock absorber),
> put lugnuts on backwards to protect threads, spanned with a crowbar and jacked the crowbar. Nothing. I beat it with a larger than average hammer.
> Nothing. PO had a drilled out 2x8 board that fit the lug circle about three feet long, tried that with the jack. Nothing. It seems like the brake
> shoes are frozen to the drum.
>
> I have a replacement brake drum available (not hub), and brake shoes.
>
> Can I drill the top of the drum to let PB Blaster run down the shoes.
> Will I have to cut the drum itself with an angle grinder?
>
> I thought about putting all the wheels on, and with the wheels on the ground try to move the coach and pop it free. After the two levered jacking
> attempts i think it will just drag that wheel.
>
> Suggestions please...

--
C. Boyd
76 Crestmont
East Tennessee
 
Spray liberally with Kroil or PB Blaster all the way around the seam between the backing plate and the drum. Also spray liberally in the hole for the
brake adjuster. Let it soak for a day or so and then attack it again with a big hammer. If that does not work I would apply heat (propane not
acetylene) and beat on the drum some more.

Good luck
--
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
 
You also might try a puller with a couple of jaws to put some tension on the drum while you are beating on it or heating it.
--
Ken Burton - N9KB
76 Palm Beach
Hebron, Indiana
 
I would use the 455 to do the grunt work. Get on some solid pavement and try rocking back and forth. The wheel and tire adds leverage. It helps if
you grew up in the snow belt to do it without hurting drivetrain.
--
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
 
If it was parked with the parking brake set, run some loosening elixir down the cable with an oilcan. Save the price of the PB, mix ATF and acetone
half and half and use that to break loose rusted stuff, it works better. Keep it off painted surfaces. I'd soak it liberally morning and night for a
couple or three days, back the adjuster off, grab it with a puller, put some tension on it, and beat hell out of it with a stubby sledge hammer around
the outside. As a last resort, split it with an angle grinder at the top and bottom, and drive a wedge in each slot and see if that won't allow you
to get it off.

--johnny
--
76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
"I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell" - ol Andy, paraphrased
 
What Johnny said. 4 Inch angle grinder with a cut off wheel. Make some relief cuts in the drum and pry it off.
--
77 Royale, Rear Dry Bath. 403, 3.55 Final Drive, Lenzi goodies, Patterson carb and dizzy.
Mid Michigan
 
Tyler,

I have seen this before. The cause (not that this matters a lot, but it will explain why this worked)was the the wheel cylinder had leaked and the
fluid being hydroscopic cause the drum to rust to the shoes. The shoes had soaked up the brake fluid and the corrosion had formed over most of the
contact area.

We managed to clear one by hitting the brake drum with a BFH On an angle at the shoulder of the drum. One we could back off the bearing and so saved
that from destruction. Other we could not and did not even try to save the bearing.

The one that did not crack the drum, we still could not save the drum as the pitting was too deep to turn clean.

I have another in my back yard that will require this and I have hopes it will turn out well.

Please let us know what works in this case.

Matt
--
Matt & Mary Colie - '73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Still Loving OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Twixt A2 and Detroit
 
Three steps forward and two steps back...
Spent the day getting the coach on its own wheels for the first time in a long time, then carb, and timing, and then trying to get the crazy wipers to
stop wiping so the windshield wouldn't get scratched up!

Tried Chuck's suggestion of adjuster wheel, but it's as gobbled as the shoes apparently.

Some more hammer. Some sledge hammer (not really swinging, just more mass). I drilled in a few places to spray in some PB Blaster. And to drill just
to shoes to try and hit them away from drum. I do believe I only have the forward shoe still stuck (this is rear passenger side), as the drum will
turn one way the amount just the shoes will give when a healthy drum is off.

I got the coach running smooth on a can in the passenger floor (a victory in itself) and tranny did want to propel the coach. I did the snow drift
rock, and it went nowhere. I think Matt called the cause of this, a leak, soak, water, and frozen to the point of nearly bonded.

So tomorrow I will raise that corner, remove the outer bearing and administrate some sledge hammer. My thinking is that with the bearing out, I can
hit one side of the drum face, and it should be able to rock against the front frozen shoe. If that won't do it, the grinder will spin next.
--
1975 Glenbrook, 1978 Royale rear bath
Raleigh, NC
 
Just dont hit the drum so hard that you mess up the hub, or bend the bogie pin. Doing more damage to parts that are harder to find and much more
expensive than a drum.

Hence the angle grinder and cut off wheel to slice through the drum/provide a little heat and hopefully some easy taps to remove. Its progress if
that drum is spinning at least one direction.
--
77 Royale, Rear Dry Bath. 403, 3.55 Final Drive, Lenzi goodies, Patterson carb and dizzy.
Mid Michigan
 
I would spare the BFH and apply heat all around heat sink area of drum. This will expand it away from shoes. You can shoot with IR gun as you go to
emulate max road temp conditions.
--
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II
 
except the brake shoes float, so heat isn't doing much.

One thing that might work is to cut off the pins that hold the shoes on. The ones that go through the backing plate.

Once they are no longer holding things together you might be able , with some effort, to pull the whole mess off in one piece. might have to cut / destroy the springs but they should be replaced anyway.

Or if you drilled the shoes can you get a punch in there and knock the shoes away from the drum? assuming you didn't drill all the way through the shoe

________________________________
From: Gmclist on behalf of John R.Lebetski
Sent: Tuesday, March 28, 2017 9:18:42 AM
To: gmclist
Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Frozen rear hub/drum solution needed

I would spare the BFH and apply heat all around heat sink area of drum. This will expand it away from shoes. You can shoot with IR gun as you go to
emulate max road temp conditions.
--
John Lebetski
Woodstock, IL
77 Eleganza II

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I like the idea of clipping the pins! I will pull one that isn't frozen to look at the feasibility, and directionality of attack.

I did try in one or three places to drill just the drum and drive the shoe with a bolt, but it didn't really generate any force away from the drum,
because the shoes are against the solid pin top and frozen adjuster at the bottom.

Rain looks to have cleared, I'll give it a go and report.
--
1975 Glenbrook, 1978 Royale rear bath
Raleigh, NC
 
To expand on that idea, remove the 4 nuts to the bolts that hold the spindle/backing plate
and the spindle nut, brake line, E cable, and remove the hole unit off the spindle.
That should make it easier to deal with. FWIW

> except the brake shoes float, so heat isn't doing much.
>
>
> One thing that might work is to cut off the pins that hold the shoes on. The ones that go through the backing plate.
>
> Once they are no longer holding things together you might be able , with some effort, to pull the whole mess off in one piece. might have to cut /
> destroy the springs but they should be replaced anyway.
>
>
> Or if you drilled the shoes can you get a punch in there and knock the shoes away from the drum? assuming you didn't drill all the way through the
> shoe
>
> ________________________________
> From: Gmclist on behalf of John R.Lebetski
> Sent: Tuesday, March 28, 2017 9:18:42 AM
> To: gmclist
> Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Frozen rear hub/drum solution needed
>
> I would spare the BFH and apply heat all around heat sink area of drum. This will expand it away from shoes. You can shoot with IR gun as you go
> to
> emulate max road temp conditions.
> --
> John Lebetski
> Woodstock, IL
> 77 Eleganza II
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
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--
”When we avoid the mistakes we might have made, we sometimes make the mistakes that we might have avoided.”

Adrien & Jenny Genesoto
75 Glenbrook 26-3
Yuba City,Ca. Text 530-nine-3-three-3-nine-nine-6
 
Success! A blend of ideas. The actual success was cutting a window in the drum with the angle grinder, then crowbar the drum away from the shoes. One
window actually gave access to push both shoes. I'll try to put a picture up tomorrow. I took the front bearings out and hoped some sledgehammer
caresses would free it, but nope. I did not try heating it and I left it all attached to the bogie. The pb blaster i put in the day before through
drilled holes had soaked to about 50% of the shoe to drum surface, don't know if that actually changed anything or not as the window I cut turned out
to be perfect for leveraging the shoes.
--
1975 Glenbrook, 1978 Royale rear bath
Raleigh, NC
 
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