hw: This notation added just before posting.
DANGER: Ramblings ahead... click on the next message if you're anti
rambling [g]
Thanks for the reply Don.
>
> Hmmmm, almost another voyage from hell?
Naw... just a little toasty in the CA sun (though some might say that's
being close to hell (CA), sorry Californians... couldn't resists. I do
like
CA except for som of the patched patches of I5
>
> I took a look at the GM book since you probably don't have yours with you.
I do have the Service Manual, but as it was quicker to disconnect for
later
diagnosis I took that route as well as asking here for some possible
real
meat stuff, i.e. battle scars before doing battle again.
>
> Oddly enough it says little about voltage but mentions above 15.5 as too
> high with a fully charged battery. They say get out the hydrometer and
> don't forget to water the batteries.
>
> They mention checking the #2 lead with an ohm meter to make certain it is
> not grounded. The insulators are sometimes left off or brush leads become
> shorted to ground, etc. This lead is connected to the battery
> through the
> fusible link and would blow it if there was a ground fault.
>
> Another item is the higher than normal heat. As temps increase
> the voltage
> needed to fully charge the battery decreases. The regulator has a
> thermistor to compensate for temp and it may be defective.
>
> Prevailer gel cell optimum varies from 14.5 volts at 32 F to 13.2 volts at
> 122 F. Flooded cells are a few tenths volt different but I forget whether
> it is less or greater.
Thanks for the confirmation re lower voltage when hot. I thought that
was
the direction but it could also have been a case of mushy
brain/heatstroke.
Glad it's not gone altogether (the brain).
>
> I don't think you can put the field plug in backward but if so ????????
I don't think you can either but it's worth a double check. thanks.
>
> Then there is the infamous diode isolator which may be a contributor. It
> will have some voltage drop across it so the alternator voltage will be
> higher by the amount of that voltage drop, than a system without one.
The diode isolator went out many years ago on the recommendation of an
RV
expert and as that was before I knew better, a solenoid has been in
there
many moons.
In retrospect, I actually think that may have been the cause of what I
call
many alternator failures over the years (instead of my abuse of
electrical
power). As I had 2 Alternators fail in as many trips I was in a better
to
position to retrace circumstances (I.e. I could still remember). On both
trips I used Roof Air, i.e. GenSet running and providing some 12vdc as
well
as Alternator running providing some 12v. When solenoid is engaged it's
a
direct connect between batteries and charging source(s). I have to
ponder
and ask another question to the electrical experts. but in the meantime
I'm
keeping them isolated when both are running.
>
> Many cruising boaters have replaced diode isolators with a
> solenoid actuated
> by the engine oil pressure switch. Said to be much more reliable.
I have the solenoid on ignition so that with key off the batteries are
isolated and I can drain the house battery without affecting the front
and
as a solenoid usually fails open it further protects the front batteries
from un-authorized drain.
>
> In any event the voltage sounds too high to me.
Yeah, thanks for the confirm. Guess I'll try and get my old one fixed on
monday and open the hatch again.
>
> Happy Trails,
>
> Don
>
BTW, at the risk of being touted long-winded by some, and to those I
suggest
you learn to speed scan your email msgs and only linger when it's of
interest to 'you'... I for one enjoy the ramblings which make this list
what
it is... interesting and informative. Same..o': one man's (person's)
treasures are anothers garbage... or is it the other way around
(In reference to the threads a couple of days ago... I could say more,
but
I'll bite my tongue, or rather my typing finger. Thanks for all the
amens
and hallelujas and please add mine).
Now for the rambling... which may very well be self serving, which I
will
not aplogize for, but hopefully it'll also be fun for others (to read my
ramblings).
Due to the net being a great help it could actually be construed by the
newcomer and/or uninitiated that the GMCs are a piece of junk, i.e.
broken
all the time or need fixing all the time, I mean all those postings
asking
for help, really[g]. That may very well be (the fixing part, not the
junk
part. However, considering that we only like negative news, i.e. we
tend
to share in another man's plight (sorry... persons') easier than in
his/her
accomplishments, that's the stuff that surfaces here... just like it
does on
the 6 o'clock news. When something good happens we get jealous and/or
accuse
the person of success of bragging or boasting.
Lets have, and continue to have, some of that bragging or boasting as
our
GMCs deserve it.
What other machine lasts 25 years... the only other that I know of is
the
airplane. We talk of trips of hell... we all have 'em, or will have.
After
all we are taking that 20+ year old piece of machinery not only to the
local
car club meeting but clear accross the country to a rally, for business
or
for personal pleasure. So what if an alternator fails or the AC quits...
not
pleasant, but not fatal either.
I now have almost 200k personal miles on my rig (It had 35k on it some
10+
years ago). Most of those were and are pleasant miles and I'll expect to
have many more. And most of those miles were done the hard way... i.e.
without GMC net. Had it been in place in my earlier days the miles
would've
been even more enjoyable as I would've been able to skip some of my hard
first-hand learned lessons because others would have told of their
experiences and I would've been able to draw a conclusion much better
informed and perhaps turned right instead of left. Take my plight of the
solenoid/alternator... had the net been in existance I most certainly
would
have had a second and/or third opinion, even if it was after the fact
which
could very well have caused it's removal or modification before failure.
All the ramblings [g] about wheels and tires... what a luxury we have to
ask
our fellow GMCer and then we still have the luxury of not listening to
anyone and just buy what we want. Ramble on folks... and don't be
embarassed
or apologetic but be braggish (new word if you got a better deal
then
everyone else... I for one appreciate knowing that there are better
deals
out there and the next time I may be able to do better myself, based on
the
knowledge I gained reading someones ramblings on the net.
By now, and especially if you read this far, you know that I use the
term
ramblings with tongue in cheek... in other words lets keep rambling on,
whether it's complaining about our coaches or to boast about them. Lets
all
boast a little more. Someone may save me a pile of money someday on your
account as I would have. Instead I was alone when I was convinced by a
GMC
expert that a certain brand of Aluminums was the way to go. Today just
by
following a thread I'd know that Alcoas are the only way to go. And if I
didn't know I could ask and some helpfull soul would jump in and give me
the
info or point me in a direction to find it, even if it's been discussed
many
times before.
As I look out the office window here in Stockton this early morning
there is
a lone white GMC sitting gracefully in the parking lot. Not quite alone
as
it's unhooked companion is parked close by. No battle scars are showing
of
the few hours of hell the owner endured ealier (other than tools still
strewn about). That lone GMC out there is what makes my on-site times
palletable and sometimes even fun. It allows me to sleep on my own
pillow in
what is by now my own, though second, bed. Sleeping on my own pillow in
familiar surroundings make a 3 hour nap seem like 12 hours of sleep. It
keeps the growlies close at hand and keeps that beer at just the right
temperature... just in case the GMC owner wants one at the end of the
day,
whatever actual time that may turn out to be. When we're done here we
tie a
few things down and stash a few things here and there, turn the key to
let
the horses come to life and off we go to do it all over again in another
city, another state. All without having to 'check-out', pack bags, worry
about what got left in the room, etc. etc.
Eventually we get home again a few thousand miles later. Perhaps we had
to
crawl underneath now and then and visit a parts store here and there...
no
big deal.
The big deal, or rather the unfortunate part is that you can't take your
rig
to the corner garage and expect them to know it and to love it as you do
(or
should). Real experts are far and few between. I envy those of you in MI
and
FL.
Since most 'mechanics' are younger than our rigs we can't expect them to
even want to learn about those archaic dinosours (until they get close
to
one so we have to help them out. This help is knowledge. Of course
then
you still have to get one of them whippersnappers to listen to you...
but
keep at 'em as it's your money they're spending.
I guess that's why there are so many driveway professionals in the GMC
community? Perhaps so, but with the help of others on the net we can
become
real good driveway pro's when it comes to our own GMC.
At least here it's not the young guy behind the parts counter that keeps
looking up the P30 chassis to sell you parts from... and insists it's
right
or simply says havn't got it as he really doesn't care. It's really
refreshing when you deal 'in' the GMC community (including this list) as
it's not havn't got, won't work, don't make it anymore but rather lets
see
where we can find one what works instead and/or someone builds one.
Ahhhh,
pride of accomplishment, however small it seems, is alive and well on
GMCnet
and in the GMC community... very refreshing.
BTW (again)... I have to commend Jim as well as Cinnebar, and the only
reason no others to commend is that I've not dealt with them 'yet'. Jim
for
giving his time and advice so freely, not just free. I can just picture
him
squished underneath with headset and boommike Jim: I hope that your
business will flourish and that you'll be able to add folks to your team
so
that we can continue to learn from you personally. Watch that proverbial
candle, the only thing more important than the GMC is the family that
rides
in one.
Cinnebar has provided me excellent service over the years. My definition
of
excellence: to have the part I 'need' in stock and to get it to me
yesterday
at a reasonable price. What's reasonable, who knows really. One can
always
find the part cheaper later or cheaper but out of stock. I'm just
thrilled
and actually amazed at the GMC rejunivation currently happening. Parts
are
easier to get, new ideas are materializing and we have a real time, real
life information interchange in this maillist, an extra special
commendation
to you Patrick.
Back to work... and some breakky out in the parking lot
Heinz
P.S.
My next rambling will be on my website after this trip. I'm going to try
and
put my memory to work and recount some of the good (and bad) times of 10
years of GMCing, most of it pre-GMCnet, i.e. truly on my own. (Glad
those
days are gone... hurray for progress).
DANGER: Ramblings ahead... click on the next message if you're anti
rambling [g]
Thanks for the reply Don.
>
> Hmmmm, almost another voyage from hell?
Naw... just a little toasty in the CA sun (though some might say that's
being close to hell (CA), sorry Californians... couldn't resists. I do
like
CA except for som of the patched patches of I5
>
> I took a look at the GM book since you probably don't have yours with you.
I do have the Service Manual, but as it was quicker to disconnect for
later
diagnosis I took that route as well as asking here for some possible
real
meat stuff, i.e. battle scars before doing battle again.
>
> Oddly enough it says little about voltage but mentions above 15.5 as too
> high with a fully charged battery. They say get out the hydrometer and
> don't forget to water the batteries.
>
> They mention checking the #2 lead with an ohm meter to make certain it is
> not grounded. The insulators are sometimes left off or brush leads become
> shorted to ground, etc. This lead is connected to the battery
> through the
> fusible link and would blow it if there was a ground fault.
>
> Another item is the higher than normal heat. As temps increase
> the voltage
> needed to fully charge the battery decreases. The regulator has a
> thermistor to compensate for temp and it may be defective.
>
> Prevailer gel cell optimum varies from 14.5 volts at 32 F to 13.2 volts at
> 122 F. Flooded cells are a few tenths volt different but I forget whether
> it is less or greater.
Thanks for the confirmation re lower voltage when hot. I thought that
was
the direction but it could also have been a case of mushy
brain/heatstroke.
Glad it's not gone altogether (the brain).
>
> I don't think you can put the field plug in backward but if so ????????
I don't think you can either but it's worth a double check. thanks.
>
> Then there is the infamous diode isolator which may be a contributor. It
> will have some voltage drop across it so the alternator voltage will be
> higher by the amount of that voltage drop, than a system without one.
The diode isolator went out many years ago on the recommendation of an
RV
expert and as that was before I knew better, a solenoid has been in
there
many moons.
In retrospect, I actually think that may have been the cause of what I
call
many alternator failures over the years (instead of my abuse of
electrical
power). As I had 2 Alternators fail in as many trips I was in a better
to
position to retrace circumstances (I.e. I could still remember). On both
trips I used Roof Air, i.e. GenSet running and providing some 12vdc as
well
as Alternator running providing some 12v. When solenoid is engaged it's
a
direct connect between batteries and charging source(s). I have to
ponder
and ask another question to the electrical experts. but in the meantime
I'm
keeping them isolated when both are running.
>
> Many cruising boaters have replaced diode isolators with a
> solenoid actuated
> by the engine oil pressure switch. Said to be much more reliable.
I have the solenoid on ignition so that with key off the batteries are
isolated and I can drain the house battery without affecting the front
and
as a solenoid usually fails open it further protects the front batteries
from un-authorized drain.
>
> In any event the voltage sounds too high to me.
Yeah, thanks for the confirm. Guess I'll try and get my old one fixed on
monday and open the hatch again.
>
> Happy Trails,
>
> Don
>
BTW, at the risk of being touted long-winded by some, and to those I
suggest
you learn to speed scan your email msgs and only linger when it's of
interest to 'you'... I for one enjoy the ramblings which make this list
what
it is... interesting and informative. Same..o': one man's (person's)
treasures are anothers garbage... or is it the other way around
(In reference to the threads a couple of days ago... I could say more,
but
I'll bite my tongue, or rather my typing finger. Thanks for all the
amens
and hallelujas and please add mine).
Now for the rambling... which may very well be self serving, which I
will
not aplogize for, but hopefully it'll also be fun for others (to read my
ramblings).
Due to the net being a great help it could actually be construed by the
newcomer and/or uninitiated that the GMCs are a piece of junk, i.e.
broken
all the time or need fixing all the time, I mean all those postings
asking
for help, really[g]. That may very well be (the fixing part, not the
junk
part
. However, considering that we only like negative news, i.e. wetend
to share in another man's plight (sorry... persons') easier than in
his/her
accomplishments, that's the stuff that surfaces here... just like it
does on
the 6 o'clock news. When something good happens we get jealous and/or
accuse
the person of success of bragging or boasting.
Lets have, and continue to have, some of that bragging or boasting as
our
GMCs deserve it.
What other machine lasts 25 years... the only other that I know of is
the
airplane. We talk of trips of hell... we all have 'em, or will have.
After
all we are taking that 20+ year old piece of machinery not only to the
local
car club meeting but clear accross the country to a rally, for business
or
for personal pleasure. So what if an alternator fails or the AC quits...
not
pleasant, but not fatal either.
I now have almost 200k personal miles on my rig (It had 35k on it some
10+
years ago). Most of those were and are pleasant miles and I'll expect to
have many more. And most of those miles were done the hard way... i.e.
without GMC net. Had it been in place in my earlier days the miles
would've
been even more enjoyable as I would've been able to skip some of my hard
first-hand learned lessons because others would have told of their
experiences and I would've been able to draw a conclusion much better
informed and perhaps turned right instead of left. Take my plight of the
solenoid/alternator... had the net been in existance I most certainly
would
have had a second and/or third opinion, even if it was after the fact
which
could very well have caused it's removal or modification before failure.
All the ramblings [g] about wheels and tires... what a luxury we have to
ask
our fellow GMCer and then we still have the luxury of not listening to
anyone and just buy what we want. Ramble on folks... and don't be
embarassed
or apologetic but be braggish (new word
if you got a better dealthen
everyone else... I for one appreciate knowing that there are better
deals
out there and the next time I may be able to do better myself, based on
the
knowledge I gained reading someones ramblings on the net.
By now, and especially if you read this far, you know that I use the
term
ramblings with tongue in cheek... in other words lets keep rambling on,
whether it's complaining about our coaches or to boast about them. Lets
all
boast a little more. Someone may save me a pile of money someday on your
account as I would have. Instead I was alone when I was convinced by a
GMC
expert that a certain brand of Aluminums was the way to go. Today just
by
following a thread I'd know that Alcoas are the only way to go. And if I
didn't know I could ask and some helpfull soul would jump in and give me
the
info or point me in a direction to find it, even if it's been discussed
many
times before.
As I look out the office window here in Stockton this early morning
there is
a lone white GMC sitting gracefully in the parking lot. Not quite alone
as
it's unhooked companion is parked close by. No battle scars are showing
of
the few hours of hell the owner endured ealier (other than tools still
strewn about). That lone GMC out there is what makes my on-site times
palletable and sometimes even fun. It allows me to sleep on my own
pillow in
what is by now my own, though second, bed. Sleeping on my own pillow in
familiar surroundings make a 3 hour nap seem like 12 hours of sleep. It
keeps the growlies close at hand and keeps that beer at just the right
temperature... just in case the GMC owner wants one at the end of the
day,
whatever actual time that may turn out to be. When we're done here we
tie a
few things down and stash a few things here and there, turn the key to
let
the horses come to life and off we go to do it all over again in another
city, another state. All without having to 'check-out', pack bags, worry
about what got left in the room, etc. etc.
Eventually we get home again a few thousand miles later. Perhaps we had
to
crawl underneath now and then and visit a parts store here and there...
no
big deal.
The big deal, or rather the unfortunate part is that you can't take your
rig
to the corner garage and expect them to know it and to love it as you do
(or
should). Real experts are far and few between. I envy those of you in MI
and
FL
.Since most 'mechanics' are younger than our rigs we can't expect them to
even want to learn about those archaic dinosours (until they get close
to
one
so we have to help them out. This help is knowledge. Of coursethen
you still have to get one of them whippersnappers to listen to you...
but
keep at 'em as it's your money they're spending.
I guess that's why there are so many driveway professionals in the GMC
community? Perhaps so, but with the help of others on the net we can
become
real good driveway pro's when it comes to our own GMC.
At least here it's not the young guy behind the parts counter that keeps
looking up the P30 chassis to sell you parts from... and insists it's
right
or simply says havn't got it as he really doesn't care. It's really
refreshing when you deal 'in' the GMC community (including this list) as
it's not havn't got, won't work, don't make it anymore but rather lets
see
where we can find one what works instead and/or someone builds one.
Ahhhh,
pride of accomplishment, however small it seems, is alive and well on
GMCnet
and in the GMC community... very refreshing.
BTW (again)... I have to commend Jim as well as Cinnebar, and the only
reason no others to commend is that I've not dealt with them 'yet'. Jim
for
giving his time and advice so freely, not just free. I can just picture
him
squished underneath with headset and boommike
Jim: I hope that yourbusiness will flourish and that you'll be able to add folks to your team
so
that we can continue to learn from you personally. Watch that proverbial
candle, the only thing more important than the GMC is the family that
rides
in one.
Cinnebar has provided me excellent service over the years. My definition
of
excellence: to have the part I 'need' in stock and to get it to me
yesterday
at a reasonable price. What's reasonable, who knows really. One can
always
find the part cheaper later or cheaper but out of stock. I'm just
thrilled
and actually amazed at the GMC rejunivation currently happening. Parts
are
easier to get, new ideas are materializing and we have a real time, real
life information interchange in this maillist, an extra special
commendation
to you Patrick.
Back to work... and some breakky out in the parking lot
Heinz
P.S.
My next rambling will be on my website after this trip. I'm going to try
and
put my memory to work and recount some of the good (and bad) times of 10
years of GMCing, most of it pre-GMCnet, i.e. truly on my own. (Glad
those
days are gone... hurray for progress).
