Birchaven pickup adventure - Texas to Portland

[benno]

Greetings forum members. I just closed the deal on this little guy


It's a 1976 Birchaven rear bath with about 60K miles on it. It's bounced around through several short term owners over the couple years, but it looks to have been loved by one of the previous owners who added several notable accessories. It has a MacNeal dash, Bogie Greasers , Air Bag Cutoff Kit, wind wings, and maybe a few others that I am unaware of. The interior is mostly original mechanicals with some reupholstery here and there.

Question on how to research the VIN: How can I trace the VIN history? Most online VIN lookup services require 17-digits however the the VIN on this vehicle is 13-digits (TZE336V10XXXX)?

Our plan is to pick it up from Texas next Wednesday (Sept 23rd) and plan to drive it back to our home in Portland, OR along this route:


Both my wife and I are new to GMC's and new to RV camping, so needless to say we have a lot to learn! Our plan is to start out slow with testing and prepping the coach systems. They are all reported to work, but not been used in the last 2 years, so there is a lot of uncertainty there. If we can get most of the systems working, we will stay in the coach and make some leisurely stops in Moab UT and Twin Falls, ID.

I could use your help in prepping / testing the coach systems....

Gas: Should I add a fuel additive to address the old fuel (seafoam, gumout, stp, etc). I have no idea how old the fuel is but it was last driven 1000-miles in January. I was thinking of filling both takes full with new gas. Suggestions?

Freshwater: I'll need to clean and flush this before using. Should I use diluted bleach or use a specialty cleaning/disinfectant product sold at camp stores? Does the shore water inlet have a pressure reducer or do I need to use an external one, if so what pressure should it be reduced to?

Propane tank: I'll need to fill it. Should I "flush the tank" or just fill it. Should I replace the original regulator with a dual stage before I get going? If so, is there a specific size model recommended.We are likely going to make a camping world visit to get supplies before we hit the road, I see this one is available.

Propane Accessories: Any special considerations testing the LP accessories (Range, H2O heater, fridge)? I was thinking of cleaning out the ignition systems with a vacuum or compressed air before lighting.

Generator: Any considerations before running this thing. I was thinking of waiting to service it until I got home. But I plan to use it on the way back, are there some must do's? I see there service kits available, can someone confirm the correct service kit for the 4000W unit?

Okay that's a lot of questions, I'll stop there.

Thanks in advance!

 

[6cuda6]

Thats gonna be a cool trip!! Bring some basic tool if you know how to use them and a couple fuel filters (get yourself a proper line wrench for the fuel filter line) just in case.

We did much the same last year....just top up the tanks, check fluids and tire pressure, lights etc..then get on your way if things look good.

Take it easy on it, so 65max for a good while so you dont kill it as you have miles to cover.

I would get yourself a few gallons of water and not worry about the coach water so much....beside if you run "light" its better on fuel....lol.

As for the rest....just wait till you get home then you can start to play....beside if for instance you have a propane leak, that could stop your trip dead.

 

[Matt Colie]

Welcome to the group, family, cult, asylum. Please build a sigfile it helps us to help you better. Try to include any serious mods.
It is a 76, so it should be a 455. If you start out with the lube oil at the FULL mark and it is way down at the first fuel, wait until the second fuel to bring it back to the ADD mark. Most 455s don't like the Full mark and just blow out the top quart. Do not let the plugs get wider than 0.035. That will take out the ignition module.
You don't say how long the coach has been sitting. That makes a lot of difference. Pay attention to what she is telling you.
If that is more than 6 months, be ready to do a "long stored" start.
Have you checked the age of the tires?
Get a printed copy of the Black's list. I have never (in 16 seasons and 70+k) been able to identify potable effect on fuel rate.
This is one of two GMC/TZE online forums. The other is older and kind of clunky, but the million mile people are there and we (I) are all willing to be what assistance we can.
We will be expecting progress reports.....
A lot of people think that the rear bath birch is one of the best of the lot.
Matt

 

[JSanford]

Question on how to research the VIN: How can I trace the VIN history? Most online VIN lookup services require 17-digits however the the VIN on this vehicle is 13-digits (TZE336V10XXXX)?

Fill out the form here http://gmcmhregistry.com/contact/form.html and Billy Massey will email you back with the known ownership history of the VIN.

 

[benno]

Thanks for the replies and tips. I'll make sure to use this thread to post updates on the whole acquisition process!

@JSanford - I filled out the registry request and will see what comes back. Much appreciated.

@Matt Colie thanks for the tip on the other forum. I'll post on that one as well.

Yes, the motor is a 455. both the motor and transmission were reportedly rebuilt 26k miles ago when the dash was also installed. I verified it's using the stock carb and fuel pump, but there is an external fuel filter. But that is the extent of the mods, I am aware of. No documentation so I am hoping there may be something that comes from the registry search.

The vehicle was last used in March for a day trip of a couple hundred miles. However, today it was moved from the storage facility to a mechanic for service. I am having the fuel filter, oil changed (Mobile 1 synthetic (15w50, filter 85049). The transmission fluid and filter changed. Chassis and bogies lubed, and any other small things that come up.

The tires were new in March when it was last serviced. Also in that service the drive train and suspension systems were inspected. Notably the wheel bearings and suspension were good. Plugs, wires, front brake pads, CV boot, steering dampener, and coach batteries were replaced. So I feel good knowing that work was done.



Question: Also in that service, they installed front wheel spacers to address steering wandering. I realize this is a common thing people do, but I have also hear this is bad for the wheel bearings because is causes extra load on the bearings. I am not sure if I should have them removed.

Suggestions appreciated.

 

[6cuda6]

Being a mecanic im on the fence about wheel spacers but there are several units out there with them and seem to run fine. Im sure if they caused major issued places like Applied GMC, who know these coaches and care about the GMC community, wouldnt sell them. That being said, do i have them on my coach, no but perhaps someone who does may chime in. YMMV of course....

 

[MarkR]

Looks like you got yourself a peach there! i hope you have the same good luck on the drive back as I did last year, bringing my Eleganza II home to PA from Seattle!

 

[Matt Colie]

That sounds like a real good start, but the wheel spacers will not stop the wandering. They introduce "torque-steer" on loose or slippery surfaces. Most likely, if she wanders on the highway then it is the steering box that is not centered up. This happens anytime the front end is aligned and the technician does not correct the toe by splitting the difference at the tie rods. In short, this happens all the time.
I hope that the engine and transmission work was just a "general principle" deal because she should not have needed that so early.

Matt

 

[tmsnyder]

Congrats! Looks like you picked a great coach!

If you can skip the 'mechanic' working on your new rig just prior to hitting the road, I would. Someone not familiar with these is liable to cause more trouble for you especially if it was driven a couple hundred miles in March. Just check the fluids and air up the tires and drive it home. The best mechanic you will end up having is you.

Fill it with 87 octane and drive it. Listen for pinging, it's usually worst under a load at partial throttle. If you hear it (sounds like clattering) back off the timing by rotating the distributor counter clockwise a little bit at a time until the pinging goes away. You can also simply pull off and plug the vacuum advance hose if it's pinging under partial throttle until you get home and go through the timing.

For water, put in 10 gallons of fresh water and a cap full of clorox bleach and run it home. Buy a few gallons of spring water to drink, eat, brush teeth but you can wash hands, flush toilet with the coach water. Don't fill the tank, it's a lot of weight you don't need.

I'd skip the propane fill until you get home. There's coffee at every gas station. If you want to play with it, have them put in 5 gallons but I wouldn't fill it until you know it's not going to leak out. And if it's not leaking there's probably already propane in it so you can probably skip it.

For the generator, check the oil. Or don't, it's probably fine, just use it if it works until you can get home and go through it.

Listen to the motor as you go. Use 2nd gear (super) or even 1st to get up and down hills. Brakes are not the best in the world so go fast up the hills and slow down the hills using the motor to brake descent. If it's running away from you downhill, hit the brakes hard and get into the next lower gear. Don't ride your brakes all the way down the hill or you won't have any at the bottom when you might need them. These have a long gear ratio, so they tend to run away on you downhill.

Have fun! Looks like a great trip home!

 

[tmsnyder]

Depending on how bad it is, a front end alignment might be a good idea before driving it home.

Mine had positive camber on one front wheel, and negative on the other. It wandered from that, especially if there was unevenness / ruts in the road. I fixed mine with an old school bubble level alignment tool. Like this one:

Magnetic Gauge Tool for Car Truck SUV Camber Castor Strut Wheel Alignment Brake 711766770938 | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Magnetic Gauge Tool for Car Truck SUV Camber Castor Strut Wheel Alignment Brake at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.com

That sounds like a real good start, but the wheel spacers will not stop the wandering. They introduce "torque-steer" on loose or slippery surfaces. Most likely, if she wanders on the highway then it is the steering box that is not centered up. This happens anytime the front end is aligned and the technician does not correct the toe by splitting the difference at the tie rods. In short, this happens all the time.
I hope that the engine and transmission work was just a "general principle" deal because she should not have needed that so early.

Matt

 

[LarryW]

Thanks for the replies and tips. I'll make sure to use this thread to post updates on the whole acquisition process!

@JSanford - I filled out the registry request and will see what comes back. Much appreciated.

@Matt Colie thanks for the tip on the other forum. I'll post on that one as well.

Yes, the motor is a 455. both the motor and transmission were reportedly rebuilt 26k miles ago when the dash was also installed. I verified it's using the stock carb and fuel pump, but there is an external fuel filter. But that is the extent of the mods, I am aware of. No documentation so I am hoping there may be something that comes from the registry search.

The vehicle was last used in March for a day trip of a couple hundred miles. However, today it was moved from the storage facility to a mechanic for service. I am having the fuel filter, oil changed (Mobile 1 synthetic (15w50, filter 85049). The transmission fluid and filter changed. Chassis and bogies lubed, and any other small things that come up.

The tires were new in March when it was last serviced. Also in that service the drive train and suspension systems were inspected. Notably the wheel bearings and suspension were good. Plugs, wires, front brake pads, CV boot, steering dampener, and coach batteries were replaced. So I feel good knowing that work was done.

View attachment 3614

Question: Also in that service, they installed front wheel spacers to address steering wandering. I realize this is a common thing people do, but I have also hear this is bad for the wheel bearings because is causes extra load on the bearings. I am not sure if I should have them removed.

Suggestions appreciated.

So, at the risk of starting oil wars, this is JMHO about oil. Driving at this time of the year when temps on your route may dip into the teens, would suggest to me that 15w50 is (again for me) too thick for the time of the year, and considering todays oil blends, 15w50 is to thick for a relatively low milage Olds 455. On a cold start, the 15w will bring oil to bearings very slowly. A 5w would serve you better in that oil would get to your bearings immediately protecting bearing surfaces. Oil not only lubricates bearing and other contact surfaces, but acts as a primary coolant by taking heat away from moving parts in the engine. So running a 50w at hot temps slows the rate of heat dissipation more than a 30w or 40w would at road temps. IMO we should be using the lowest viscosity oil that maintains acceptable oil pressure at hot idle and highway speeds. The old phrase of 10psi for every 1000rpm is still probably a good guideline. With this in mind, IMO, the ideal oil for our engines would be a 5w30, 5w40 or 0w40. Two oils come to mind that have very good wear resistance ratings. 5W30 Quaker State Ultimate Durability, synthetic (green bottle) and 0W40 Mobil 1 “FS” European Car Formula. I've been using the 0w40 in my 500 Cad for several years now and my oil test come back clean. So, again...JMHO. Take it for what it is worth.

As for the spacers, I've been running them since 2005 with no ill effects. But then, I did the bearings before I installed the spacers. You should know that spacers will not effect wandering. Chances are if your steering has been worked on in the past, the CV joint is probably clocked wrong, or toe-in has been adjusted improperly. Lots of other things that could be causing but those are the most common. I like the spacers for one reason only and admittedly for a weak reason, I like the look it gives the coach with the wheels out another 2". Personally, IMO, take the spacers off until you get the coach home and can check your bearing situation out. When you get that far, come back to us for more opinions on how to handle it.

Just my relatively informed, off the cuff, back yard mechanic, gut level, eyeball it up and guestimate, opinion....that's all...

 

[tmsnyder]

I'm with you, 50w seems real thick, I did a double take on that one too.

Many run 15w40 rotella diesel oil, it's supposed to still have some of the good zinc in it.

So, at the risk of starting oil wars, this is JMHO about oil. Driving at this time of the year when temps on your route may dip into the teens, would suggest to me that 15w50 is (again for me) too thick for the time of the year, and considering todays oil blends, 15w50 is to thick for a relatively low milage Olds 455. On a cold start, the 15w will bring oil to bearings very slowly. A 5w would serve you better in that oil would get to your bearings immediately protecting bearing surfaces. Oil not only lubricates bearing and other contact surfaces, but acts as a primary coolant by taking heat away from moving parts in the engine. So running a 50w at hot temps slows the rate of heat dissipation more than a 30w or 40w would at road temps. IMO we should be using the lowest viscosity oil that maintains acceptable oil pressure at hot idle and highway speeds. The old phrase of 10psi for every 1000rpm is still probably a good guideline. With this in mind, IMO, the ideal oil for our engines would be a 5w30, 5w40 or 0w40. Two oils come to mind that have very good wear resistance ratings. 5W30 Quaker State Ultimate Durability, synthetic (green bottle) and 0W40 Mobil 1 “FS” European Car Formula. I've been using the 0w40 in my 500 Cad for several years now and my oil test come back clean. So, again...JMHO. Take it for what it is worth.

As for the spacers, I've been running them since 2005 with no ill effects. But then, I did the bearings before I installed the spacers. You should know that spacers will not effect wandering. Chances are if your steering has been worked on in the past, the CV joint is probably clocked wrong, or toe-in has been adjusted improperly. Lots of other things that could be causing but those are the most common. I like the spacers for one reason only and admittedly for a weak reason, I like the look it gives the coach with the wheels out another 2". Personally, IMO, take the spacers off until you get the coach home and can check your bearing situation out. When you get that far, come back to us for more opinions on how to handle it.

Just my relatively informed, off the cuff, back yard mechanic, gut level, eyeball it up and guestimate, opinion....that's all...

 

[LarryW]

I'm with you, 50w seems real thick, I did a double take on that one too.

Many run 15w40 rotella diesel oil, it's supposed to still have some of the good zinc in it.

Surprisingly, some of the oils that have been used by GMC'rs have not tested very well in terms of resistance to wear. Keep in mind, diesel oil is formulated for the specifics of Diesel engine operation and may not provide the protection needed in a gas engine. Independent testing has shown that thick oil does not necessarily provide more protection and ZDDP is not necessarily a formula for wear protection. Again...JMHO

 

[tmsnyder]

I believe it! Oil has changed a lot in 40 years, and not for the better for our old Olds engines.

What do you use in your 500 Cad?

Surprisingly, some of the oils that have been used by GMC'rs have not tested very well in terms of resistance to wear. Keep in mind, diesel oil is formulated for the specifics of Diesel engine operation and may not provide the protection needed in a gas engine. Independent testing has shown that thick oil does not necessarily provide more protection and ZDDP is not necessarily a formula for wear protection. Again...JMHO

 

[benno]

Ok ok, I understand your concerns on oil weight and will take them under consideration if the work has not already been done. FWIW the oil recommendation came from DJ's Classic GMC Motorhome. Oil brands and weight seem to be universally contested on automotive forums... I'll review the oil debate conversations in the technical forum for more insight.

Thanks so much for the useful comments and recommendations on spacers. I'll do an alignment check. Hopefully I can do it when I get back.

 

[LarryW]

I've been using the 0W40 Mobil 1 “FS” European Car Formula in my 500 Cad for several years now. Oil pressure at Highway speeds runs 45-48psi and hot idle mostly around 35lbs but has been as low as 25psi on a hot day pushing a wind while running at 2800rpm. Oil testing of 3000mile oil shows very low numbers of the essential metals. Starting the engine on cold mornings with the "0" weight gets me oil pressure immediately with pressure building over 30 seconds to 55psi. The down side of the "0w" is, because it is a 0w, it can flow off of bearings easier when standing idle for long periods. With that in mind, after long idle periods, I pull the ignition wire and trigger wire for the FI, and turn over until I see oil pressure. Then hookup wires and start engine assured that there is oil on the bearings for that cold start. JWID

 

[LarryW]

Ok ok, I understand your concerns on oil weight and will take them under consideration if the work has not already been done. FWIW the oil recommendation came from DJ's Classic GMC Motorhome. Oil brands and weight seem to be universally contested on automotive forums... I'll review the oil debate conversations in the technical forum for more insight.

Thanks so much for the useful comments and recommendations on spacers. I'll do an alignment check. Hopefully I can do it when I get back.

FWIW, I have picked up information from a lot of oil blogs, some oil company forums, and several independent blogs. The one I found most informative, and also the most tedious reading is from Bob the oil guy.

MOTOR OIL ENGINEERING TEST DATA

….On smart phones, “Q&A” CAN NOW BE ACCESSED BY CLICKING ON THE 3 HORIZONTAL BARS IN THE UPPER LEFT HAND CORNER…..******..With so many different Blog readers coming here…

540ratblog.wordpress.com

Last updated August of 2020. Long, lots of repetition, self promotion, but can't deny the science. While a interesting read, you can get to the meat of the blog by taking a hold of the advance bar and pull it down about 1/10th of the way to the part numerically ranking the over 240 different oils. Read and judge for yourself.

 

[Matt Colie]

Mike,

You don't know me, but the guys here and the other forum know me well. I am a ship's engineer that came ashore 40 odd years ago and spent that until retirement in engine development labs in this little mid-western city (Detroit). In all that time, I took two short forays out of dyno-land but always came back. Now, why does this matter to you here and now? Oil, it is harder to get bad oil than it is to get good oil these days.

About your planned excursion, if the coach is right, they are very comfortable to drive. That is nice, but the body still wears down. FACT - When you get tired, you also get stupid. Driving tired is a good way to end up dead. If you are alone, be very cautious. If you have a co-driver you can do better. Having a navigator when you are in unfamiliar cities is almost essential. I am guessing you will be using a GPS. Do not count on Waze or Google Maps as you may loose coverage at inconvenient times. You can set up the GPS for the planned days travel and enjoy driving.

I do run M1 15W50 and have for 70+K miles. A year ago a piston broke a land and subsequently lost about 120° of rings. There was so little wear in the bores that if I had know the manufacturer of the pistons installed, I could have replaced just the one.

During the excursion you have planned, do not bother adjusting the current lube oil. Run it until you get home with one and one only provision...
Do not use more than medium throttle until the temperature gauge is off the pin. In fact, that is always a good plan. Even if it was ZeroF and the engine had 15W50 in it all you have to do is be just a little patient. The OE manual recommended a 10SAE for operation down to -10°F. That is not far off the 15 winter of the 15W(inter)50.

You may choose to play with this, but do it when you are standing in your driveway. And I do hope that other than the scenery of your planned route, that it is boring as hell. But, if there is some excitement have your Black's list printed. Yes, I am in there but I am two or three time zones away.

I see you did fill in a sigfile, that will serve both you and us well.
Be aware that this is a very supportive and helping community that really wants you to enjoy both the coach and what she can do for you. Treat her well and she will be good to you. This community is so like that of the watermen of my world, I have take to welcoming new owners much as you would be there. So,

May the Good Lord bless this coach and all those that set forth within her.

Matt

 

[1976GMC]

Congrats on your acquisition. Looks like a great find. Folks with much more knowledge and experience than me have weighed in on the important stuff. The only thing I can say is - have a safe trip. Definitely have a copy of The Black List with you. Looks like you'll be within few hours of me towards the end leg of your trip.

 

[benno]

Thanks all for the advice. I’ve started preparing my supplies that I’ll fly with and I’ll look into the black list and keep everyone updated. Look for an update Wednesday eventing.