Mercedes Cooling Fan temperature settings

[billvv]

Some recent posters on FB have had noise complaints with the Mercedes Fan, and I understand that if the fan is slowed down to about 50% there is still
plenty of air movement but little noise. I've found a controller that says that the user can set the PWM frequency from 1 Hz to 99kHz and duty cycle
from 0 - 100%.

This controller is ridiculously inexpensive ($14.00) but given its offshore pedigree there is absolutely no recourse to a manufacturer for support. 

Here's a link.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B081YQW36Z/

Anyone with a MB fan want to try it and report back?

--
Bill Van Vlack
'76 Royale; Guemes Island, Washington; Twin bed, full (DS) side bath, Brazilian Redwood counter and settee tops,455, 6KW generator; new owner a/o mid
November 2015.

 

[Matt Colie]

I am in the process of doing some other work about the engine, so while there I am going to bury thermocouples ins both coolant in and out. When I
learn more, it will let everybody know. In dynoland, we might control by either one, but I like coolant in as it yields more consistent results.

Matt
--
Matt & Mary Colie - Chaumière -'73 Glacier 23 - Members GMCMI, GMCGL, GMCES
Electronically Controlled Quiet Engine Cooling Fan with OE Rear Drum Brakes with Applied Control Arms
SE Michigan - Near DTW - Twixt A2 and Detroit

 

[billvv]

It turns out Applied is now providing an adjustable speed control system with their MB fan kit. That should be a great improvement over the previous
full on/full off controller, available from a stand-up supplier!
--
Bill Van Vlack
'76 Royale; Guemes Island, Washington; Twin bed, full (DS) side bath, Brazilian Redwood counter and settee tops,455, 6KW generator; new owner a/o mid
November 2015.

 

[78gmcroyale]

Do you have further details?Sent from my U.S.Cellular© Smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: Bill Van Vlack via Gmclist Date: 10/8/20 12:29 AM (GMT-06:00) To: gmclist Cc: Bill Van Vlack Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Mercedes Cooling Fan temperature settings It turns out Applied is now providing an adjustable speed control system with their MB fan kit. That should be a great improvement over the previousfull on/full off controller, available from a stand-up supplier!-- Bill Van Vlack'76 Royale; Guemes Island, Washington; Twin bed, full (DS) side bath, Brazilian Redwood counter and settee tops,455, 6KW generator; new owner a/o midNovember 2015._______________________________________________GMCnet mailing listUnsubscribe or Change List Options:http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org

 

[billvv]

Quote:
> Do you have further details?

The new version of the MB fan controller is on the Applied site, shown as part of the MB fan kit. It has a PWM speed control dial that you use to set
fan speed percentage and a display that shows the %age setting. I understand that 50% speed is quiet and adequate. I believe it also has a way to set
the on and off temperatures, but it's not obvious from the info on the Applied site. The controller also has an 'override' function which runs the fan
continuously at whatever speed is set by the PWM dial. You'd have to phone Applied to find out whether they are selling it separately and the cost.

It will be interesting to see how folks approach speed settings.
--
Bill Van Vlack
'76 Royale; Guemes Island, Washington; Twin bed, full (DS) side bath, Brazilian Redwood counter and settee tops,455, 6KW generator; new owner a/o mid
November 2015.

 

[Tom Pryor]

So Folks, you can go to this site to view Fan and the kit that I supply
APPLIED to install and control the Fan.
https://www.gmcrvparts.com/product-p/g46104.htm
MAKE SURE YOU SEE BOTH PHOTOS. The SECOND image shows the kit contents,
wiring, MB connector, 195/210 degree temp. switch and the Fan 2 controller.

If you want to be assured that the kit is desirable, watch this youtube
clip. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjA_INl9y80&feature=youtu.be

With all that being said, where to put the temperature probe, Matt Colley
is working on instrumenting his radiator and engine for thermal mapping.
Matt you say "I like "coolant in" as it yields more consistent results."
My question is coolant into the engine, or coolant into the radiator? Why?

As a side note, I am working on a stand alone controller that will be
driven by those of you that have an EBL version of the EFI. I'm sure that
most of the other Popular EFI kits could also be employed.

Stay Safe All!

--
Regards,

Tom Pryor
4188 Limerick Dr
Lake Wales, Fl 33859
Cell 248 470 9186

1977 23'B named "CASPER", HARDLY ORIGINAL, (455 EFI) (Pwr. Drive)
(tailgate) (rear bunk beds)
(Webasto petrol boiler) (MB Elect fan clutch) (Brake reaction arms) BUT
STILL A WORK IN PROGRESS!

ReplyForward

 

[billvv]

Quote:
> As a side note, I am working on a stand alone controller that will be
> driven by those of you that have an EBL version of the EFI. I'm sure that
> most of the other Popular EFI kits could also be employed.

Maybe a selector switch PROBE-EFI-OVERRIDE and just one version. For folks that carry a QJ as a backup to their EFI or change between QJ and EFI or
vice versa at a later date.
--
Bill Van Vlack
'76 Royale; Guemes Island, Washington; Twin bed, full (DS) side bath, Brazilian Redwood counter and settee tops,455, 6KW generator; new owner a/o mid
November 2015.

 

[powwerjon]

Comes up in Youtube as “Video unavailable, this video is private”.

JR Wright

>
> So Folks, you can go to this site to view Fan and the kit that I supply
> APPLIED to install and control the Fan.
> https://www.gmcrvparts.com/product-p/g46104.htm
> MAKE SURE YOU SEE BOTH PHOTOS. The SECOND image shows the kit contents,
> wiring, MB connector, 195/210 degree temp. switch and the Fan 2 controller.
>
> If you want to be assured that the kit is desirable, watch this youtube
> clip. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjA_INl9y80&feature=youtu.be
>
> With all that being said, where to put the temperature probe, Matt Colley
> is working on instrumenting his radiator and engine for thermal mapping.
> Matt you say "I like "coolant in" as it yields more consistent results."
> My question is coolant into the engine, or coolant into the radiator? Why?
>
>
> As a side note, I am working on a stand alone controller that will be
> driven by those of you that have an EBL version of the EFI. I'm sure that
> most of the other Popular EFI kits could also be employed.
>
> Stay Safe All!
>
> --
> Regards,
>
> Tom Pryor
> 4188 Limerick Dr
> Lake Wales, Fl 33859
> Cell 248 470 9186
>
> 1977 23'B named "CASPER", HARDLY ORIGINAL, (455 EFI) (Pwr. Drive)
> (tailgate) (rear bunk beds)
> (Webasto petrol boiler) (MB Elect fan clutch) (Brake reaction arms) BUT
> STILL A WORK IN PROGRESS!
>
> ReplyForward
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org

 

[michael hunt]

Yes that's the same thing I got too.

On Thu, Oct 8, 2020, 2:25 PM John Wright via Gmclist <

> Comes up in Youtube as “Video unavailable, this video is private”.
>
> JR Wright
> > On Oct 8, 2020, at 12:40 PM, Thomas Pryor via Gmclist <

> >
> > So Folks, you can go to this site to view Fan and the kit that I supply
> > APPLIED to install and control the Fan.
> > https://www.gmcrvparts.com/product-p/g46104.htm
> > MAKE SURE YOU SEE BOTH PHOTOS. The SECOND image shows the kit contents,
> > wiring, MB connector, 195/210 degree temp. switch and the Fan 2
> controller.
> >
> > If you want to be assured that the kit is desirable, watch this youtube
> > clip. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjA_INl9y80&feature=youtu.be
> >
> > With all that being said, where to put the temperature probe, Matt Colley
> > is working on instrumenting his radiator and engine for thermal mapping.
> > Matt you say "I like "coolant in" as it yields more consistent results."
> > My question is coolant into the engine, or coolant into the radiator?
> Why?
> >
> >
> > As a side note, I am working on a stand alone controller that will be
> > driven by those of you that have an EBL version of the EFI. I'm sure that
> > most of the other Popular EFI kits could also be employed.
> >
> > Stay Safe All!
> >
> > --
> > Regards,
> >
> > Tom Pryor
> > 4188 Limerick Dr
> > Lake Wales, Fl 33859
> > Cell 248 470 9186
> >
> > 1977 23'B named "CASPER", HARDLY ORIGINAL, (455 EFI) (Pwr. Drive)
> > (tailgate) (rear bunk beds)
> > (Webasto petrol boiler) (MB Elect fan clutch) (Brake reaction arms) BUT
> > STILL A WORK IN PROGRESS!
> >
> > ReplyForward
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> > http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>

 

[78gmcroyale]

YouTube video says it's "private".Sent from my U.S.Cellular=C2=A9 Smart=
phone -------- Original message --------From: Thomas Pryor via Gmclist Date: 10/8/20 11:40 AM (GMT-06:00) To: gmclist=
st.gmcnet.org Cc: Thomas Pryor Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Me=
rcedes Cooling Fan temperature settings So Folks, you can go to this site t=
o view Fan and the kit that I supplyAPPLIED to install and control the Fan.=
https://www.gmcrvparts.com/product-p/g46104.htmMAKE SURE YOU SEE BOTH PHOTO=
S.=C2=A0=C2=A0 The SECOND image shows the kit contents,wiring, MB connector=
, 195/210 degree temp. switch and the Fan 2 controller.If you want to be as=
sured that the kit is desirable, watch this youtubeclip.=C2=A0 https://www.=
youtube.com/watch?v vjA_INl9y80&feature youtu.beWith all that being sai=
d, where to put the temperature probe, Matt Colleyis working on instrumenti=
ng his radiator and engine for thermal mapping.Matt you say "I like "coolan=
t in" as it yields more consistent results."My question is coolant into the=
engine, or coolant into the radiator?=C2=A0 Why?As a side note, I am worki=
ng on a stand alone controller that will bedriven by those of you that have=
an EBL version of the EFI. I'm sure thatmost of the other Popular EFI kits=
could also be employed.Stay Safe All!-- Regards,Tom Pryor4188 Limerick DrL=
ake Wales, Fl 33859Cell 248 470 91861977 23'B named "CASPER",=C2=A0 HARDLY =
ORIGINAL, (455 EFI) (Pwr. Drive)(tailgate) (rear bunk beds)(Webasto petrol =
boiler) (MB Elect fan clutch) (Brake reaction arms) BUTSTILL A WORK IN PROG=
RESS!ReplyForward_______________________________________________GMCnet mail=
ing listUnsubscribe or Change List Options:http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/l=
istinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org

 

[78gmcroyale]

If we already have the MB system can we buy the new PWM controller?Sent =
from my U.S.Cellular=C2=A9 Smartphone -------- Original message --------=
From: Thomas Pryor via Gmclist Date: 10/8/20 11:=
40 AM (GMT-06:00) To: gmclist Cc: Thomas Pryor Subject: Re: [GMCnet] Mercedes Cooling Fan temperature settings So=
Folks, you can go to this site to view Fan and the kit that I supplyAPPLIE=
D to install and control the Fan.https://www.gmcrvparts.com/product-p/g4610=
4.htmMAKE SURE YOU SEE BOTH PHOTOS.=C2=A0=C2=A0 The SECOND image shows the =
kit contents,wiring, MB connector, 195/210 degree temp. switch and the Fan =
2 controller.If you want to be assured that the kit is desirable, watch thi=
s youtubeclip.=C2=A0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v vjA_INl9y80&feature=
youtu.beWith all that being said, where to put the temperature probe, Ma=
tt Colleyis working on instrumenting his radiator and engine for thermal ma=
pping.Matt you say "I like "coolant in" as it yields more consistent result=
s."My question is coolant into the engine, or coolant into the radiator?=
=C2=A0 Why?As a side note, I am working on a stand alone controller that wi=
ll bedriven by those of you that have an EBL version of the EFI. I'm sure t=
hatmost of the other Popular EFI kits could also be employed.Stay Safe All!=
-- Regards,Tom Pryor4188 Limerick DrLake Wales, Fl 33859Cell 248 470 918619=
77 23'B named "CASPER",=C2=A0 HARDLY ORIGINAL, (455 EFI) (Pwr. Drive)(tailg=
ate) (rear bunk beds)(Webasto petrol boiler) (MB Elect fan clutch) (Brake r=
eaction arms) BUTSTILL A WORK IN PROGRESS!ReplyForward_____________________=
__________________________GMCnet mailing listUnsubscribe or Change List Opt=
ions:http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org

 

[SteveW]

So... Just a quick post to keep this thread alive.

I'm keenly interested in this project and will be experimenting with instrumentation to capture temperatures and controllers to regulate fan speed...
I'm also considering a tachometer on the fan for another level of detailed data collection. (I'm thinking that engine speed is also a factor - the
clutch is engaging about a faster spinning shaft - no ??)

I'm messing with a small PID controller (Thank You Captain Jack) and also with some "manual" PWM controllers (Thank You Bill Van Vlack).

And Matt - I'm interested in your instrumentation results too !!

To be continued - what a great community.

Steve W

--
Steve W
1973 : 23'
Southern California

 

[78gmcroyale]

I'm very interested in this too.Sent from my U.S.Cellular=C2=A9 Smartph=
one -------- Original message --------From: Steve Weinstock via Gmclist Date: 11/3/20 3:16 PM (GMT-06:00) To: gmclist=
st.gmcnet.org Cc: Steve Weinstock Subject: Re: [G=
MCnet] Mercedes Cooling Fan temperature settings So...=C2=A0 Just a quick p=
ost to keep this thread alive.I'm keenly interested in this project and wil=
l be experimenting with instrumentation to capture temperatures and control=
lers to regulate fan speed... I'm also considering a tachometer on the fan =
for another level of detailed data collection.=C2=A0 (I'm thinking that eng=
ine speed is also a factor - theclutch is engaging about a faster spinning =
shaft - no ??)I'm messing with a small PID controller (Thank You Captain Ja=
ck) and also with some "manual" PWM controllers (Thank You Bill Van Vlack).=
And Matt - I'm interested in your instrumentation results too !!To be conti=
nued - what a great community.Steve W-- Steve W1973 : 23'Southern Californi=
a_______________________________________________GMCnet mailing listUnsubscr=
ibe or Change List Options:http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_=
list.gmcnet.org

 

[Jim Hupy]

It seems to me, that this subject has been kicked around for literally
decades. Fast track back into the past if you will. Back to when we could
still buy OEM fan clutches. Oh, what's that you say? You were still in
elementary school? Well, back in that era, we had a very knowledgeable guy
named Steve Ferguson. He is still around, but has sold his GMC and
purchased a S.O.B. He maintains his membership in Western States, and other
clubs as well. He built a testing platform, powered by an electric fan
motor with an amp draw gage so that he could detect how much load various
fan clutches and fan combinations put on the engine. He tested every fan
clutch on the market, as well as various fans that were available at that
time. He documented that very well, and did a very good presentation at a
few rallies.
As I recall, he was treated quite poorly by some of the GMCMI
membership from the eastern part of the US. I don't remember names, they
are not important, especially in this day and age. But, it taught me a few
things about how to do presentations at rallies, which I still use today.
But today is a different era. Those Mercedes fans were not even
invented, then. Do we really need all that data to tell if our engines are
cool enough, or hot enough? Shoot, I don't know, and as long as my coach
keeps purring down the road, I'm not sure I give a rusty rat's behind. But
I am in the minority, it seems.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Oregon

On Tue, Nov 3, 2020, 1:16 PM Steve Weinstock via Gmclist <

> So... Just a quick post to keep this thread alive.
>
> I'm keenly interested in this project and will be experimenting with
> instrumentation to capture temperatures and controllers to regulate fan
> speed...
> I'm also considering a tachometer on the fan for another level of detailed
> data collection. (I'm thinking that engine speed is also a factor - the
> clutch is engaging about a faster spinning shaft - no ??)
>
> I'm messing with a small PID controller (Thank You Captain Jack) and also
> with some "manual" PWM controllers (Thank You Bill Van Vlack).
>
> And Matt - I'm interested in your instrumentation results too !!
>
> To be continued - what a great community.
>
> Steve W
>
>
>
>
> --
> Steve W
> 1973 : 23'
> Southern California
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>

 

[SteveW]

Hello Jim !!

I agree with you - except that I'm a persistent tinkerer with access to too many laboratory devices.

And I had a short stint with a couple of not-completely-properly-functioning (Hayden) fan clutches... that's what put me into this rabbit's hole.


And I remember Steve Ferguson's project too. That was some nice work.

All good in Southern California,
Steve W

--
Steve W
1973 : 23'
Southern California

 

[jim kanomata1]

Jim H,
You know I supplied all the fan clutches to Steve F for his test.
I have been running this Electronic device forever 60,000 miles all across
the USA and can tell you that on off only is not very great.
It cycles a lot more frequently as once the fan has no power there is very
little rotation of the fan and actually restricts the flow of air through
the radiator so it starts heating up sooner than if the fan was running
30-40 percent after pulling the heat level to 190 degrees.
I have the new one Tom P I purchased from him and installed to test.
Hope to learn if 30-40% is as good as 55% .
The ambient temp being lower will not help me to come up with any great
data.

Just look at the wide cord of the blades

On Tue, Nov 3, 2020 at 2:30 PM Steve Weinstock via Gmclist <

> Hello Jim !!
>
> I agree with you - except that I'm a persistent tinkerer with access to
> too many laboratory devices.
>
> And I had a short stint with a couple of
> not-completely-properly-functioning (Hayden) fan clutches... that's what
> put me into this rabbit's hole.
>
>
> And I remember Steve Ferguson's project too. That was some nice work.
>
> All good in Southern California,
> Steve W
>
> --
> Steve W
> 1973 : 23'
> Southern California
>
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>

--
Jim Kanomata
Applied/GMC, Newark,CA
jimk
http://www.gmcrvparts.com
1-800-752-7502

 

[Jim Hupy]

There is a whole bunch of variables in various years of GMC motorhomes. The
early coaches had different baffles and fans and clutches than the late
coaches do. All was well until the quality of fan clutches went sideways. I
am not against variable speed fans. They have their purposes.
Jim Hupy
Salem, Oregon

On Tue, Nov 3, 2020, 4:48 PM Jim Kanomata via Gmclist <

> Jim H,
> You know I supplied all the fan clutches to Steve F for his test.
> I have been running this Electronic device forever 60,000 miles all across
> the USA and can tell you that on off only is not very great.
> It cycles a lot more frequently as once the fan has no power there is very
> little rotation of the fan and actually restricts the flow of air through
> the radiator so it starts heating up sooner than if the fan was running
> 30-40 percent after pulling the heat level to 190 degrees.
> I have the new one Tom P I purchased from him and installed to test.
> Hope to learn if 30-40% is as good as 55% .
> The ambient temp being lower will not help me to come up with any great
> data.
>
> Just look at the wide cord of the blades
>
> On Tue, Nov 3, 2020 at 2:30 PM Steve Weinstock via Gmclist <

>
> > Hello Jim !!
> >
> > I agree with you - except that I'm a persistent tinkerer with access to
> > too many laboratory devices.
> >
> > And I had a short stint with a couple of
> > not-completely-properly-functioning (Hayden) fan clutches... that's what
> > put me into this rabbit's hole.
> >
> >
> > And I remember Steve Ferguson's project too. That was some nice work.
> >
> > All good in Southern California,
> > Steve W
> >
> > --
> > Steve W
> > 1973 : 23'
> > Southern California
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > GMCnet mailing list
> > Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> > http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
> >
>
>
> --
> Jim Kanomata
> Applied/GMC, Newark,CA
> jimk
> http://www.gmcrvparts.com
> 1-800-752-7502
> _______________________________________________
> GMCnet mailing list
> Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
> http://list.gmcnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gmclist_list.gmcnet.org
>

 

[johnny]

Steve - the MB fan (and all the others I've seen) have a pulsetrain of the rotating speed, the three center pins. You'll have to chase the proper
polarity, but if you feed it 5 volts and ground, the last pin will give you a pulse train of six pulses per rev. For true RPM, get a cheap tachometer
that's settable. Set it for a six cylinder engine and use some marker and rub off numbers to halve the reading on the tach. You then have true fan
speed. Optionally, you can use a flipflop to divide the pulse train by two and feed it directly to a 6 cylinder tach. For your engine, do the same
with a tach set for 4 cylinders, thus an 8K tach becomes a 4K and is easier to read in your coach. Unless he'sswappedthe dash around, Mike Briere has
this setup in the 23' he got from me.

--johnny
--
Foolish Carriage, 76 26' Eleganza(?) with beaucoup mods and add - ons.
Braselton, Ga.
I forgive them all, save those who hurt the dogs. They must answer to me in hell